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What's the deal with MS05-002 (KB891711.EXE) and Windows 98?



 
 
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  #21  
Old March 13th 05, 02:49 PM
Dan
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Thanks for letting me know. Do you have a broadband connection and are you
willing to share any software that you have at this newsgroup with us? You
do not have to tell us if you do not want to of course.

"SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
...
: Well, we live in an era of 'instant PC Experts'
:
: the typical'my brother in law-sez, ......., and the secretary at work.....
:
: roof is needed not rumors.
:
: I've had the update for 4 days and nothing has raised an ugly head yet.
:
: "Dan" wrote in message
: ...
: It is just what people are saying. I don't have any proof.
:
: "SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
: ...
: : Any particular boards?
: :
: : Is this well founded and some one has absolute proof, or just some one
: : saying it must be ...?
: :
: : "Dan" wrote in message
: : ...
: : Read the discussion boards and you will see that it is causing havoc
: with
: : some user's machines and associated software and/or hardware. For
: some
: of
: : the users baddies are definately involved but definately not with all
: the
: : users.
: :
: : "SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
: : ...
: : : Whata's the downside of this update?
: : :
: : : "Ivan Bútora" wrote in message
: : : ...
: : : Dan, please. ANY update is optional. It is up to me if I want to
: : install
: : : it on my machine or not. Yes, I think it's good to install these
: updates
: : in
: : : general, and I have installed all of them except KB891711. But on
: the
: : other
: : : hand, there are upsides and downsides. In the case of KB891711, the
: : : inconvenience and trouble that is likely to be caused by this patch
: is
: : far
: : : greater than the risk of a hacker exploiting your machine. Keep in
: mind
: : that
: : : there have been several updates this year considered "important"
for
: : Windows
: : : 98 that have not been released publicly. As Gary Terhune pointed
: out,
: : the
: : : difference between "important" and "critical" is actually not so
: : significant
: : : in terms of the security threat. So yeah, your machine probably
*is*
: : : vulnerable to something. But that's life, you can't be 100% secure
: all
: : the
: : : time. I don't see the point in making such a big fuss about not
: having
: : this
: : : one patch installed.
: : :
: : : And FYI, since September 2004, my computer has been running
: WITHOUT
: : : anti-virus protection, anti-spyware, etc. So yesterday I decided I
: would
: : run
: : : a SpyBot check just for the hell of it, and guess what - nothing
: found
: : other
: : : than a couple of IE cookies. My point: The most important thing is
: being
: : : aware of what you're doing with your computer and on the Internet.
: : :
: : : Frankly, I don't know what your letter to Bill Gates was, but
what
: I
: : do
: : : know is that MS should be ashamed for releasing a patch in this
: manner,
: : : without informing the users of the potential caveats, and
apparently
: : without
: : : testing in dial-up systems, etc.
: : :
: : :
: : :
: : : "Dan" wrote in message
: : : ...
: : : According to PC Today, April issue it is a critical update that
: has
: : as
: : : of now
: : : not been exploited by hackers. Guys and Gals you need this
: critical
: : : update
: : : because I am guessing within 3 weeks someone will find a way to
: : : compromise
: : : all 98SE and associated 9x machines that need the patch and
have
: not
: : : been
: : : updated. My best guess is that the time for the hackers will
be
: a
: : : maximum of
: : : 3 weeks and it may be even faster so if your machine is
: connected
: to
: : the
: : : Internet do whatever it takes to keep "KB891711.EXE" running
: because
: : I
: : : am
: : : sure down the line Microsoft will be able to do a better fix
but
: : this
: : is
: : : a
: : : temporary solution, hopefully to allow users to be safe while
: : on-line.
: : : If
: : : programs are not responding then discover why. People you need
: this
: : : CRITICAL
: : : PATCH and it is not optional. If Windows will not run with the
: : patch
: : : because
: : : of BSOD then disconnect from the Internet -- remove Ethernet
: cable,
: : USB
: : : cable
: : : or phone cable until the problem is resolved because if you do
: not
: : do
: : : this
: : : and have exited this CRITICAL PATCH then you are just asking
for
: : your
: : : system
: : : to be hacked and no it will not be by me or my friends although
: I
: : know
: : a
: : : lot
: : : about security on computers and weak access points and could
: : probably
: : do
: : : it
: : : without too much trouble if I wanted to but my heart is with
: keeping
: : the
: : : U.S.A and its Allies and businesses and finally consumers to
try
: and
: : get
: : : one
: : : small leg up on the PEOPLE who hack machines for a hobby, the
: : : terriorists and
: : : finally the script kiddies. Let me know how I and others can
: help
: : you
: : : with
: : : your computer problems. Have a nice day!
: : :
: : : "98 Guy" wrote in message
: : ...
: : : :
: : : : If you don't know what I'm talking about, look he
: : : :
: : : :
: http://www.microsoft.com/technet/sec.../MS05-002.mspx
: : : :
: : : : If you're running Win 98, and have recently (within the past
: week)
: : : : gone to Windows Updates and updated your computer, you almost
: : : : certainly now have the file "KB891711.EXE" running in the
: : background.
: : : : It is set to run automatically at startup. First time any
: such
: : update
: : : : or security patch has been configured to operate (instead of
: : simply
: : : : replacing an existing file).
: : : :
: : : : Even though Micro$loth sez that MS05-002 (KB891711.EXE) is
: : critical
: : : : for Win-98, I've read where some (many) people are simply
: : deactivating
: : : : it (via msconfig).
: : : :
: : : : Does anyone really know the truth regarding Win-98 and
: : KB891711.EXE?
: : : :
: : : : Is there anything special about it (like running it in safe
: mode
: : to
: : : : properly install it) ?
: : : :
: : : : Is it really needed? (for win-98) ?
: : : :
: : : : Is Win-98 really vulnerable to MS05-002 ???
: : :
: : :
: : :
: :
: :
: :
:
:
:


  #22  
Old March 13th 05, 05:50 PM
glee
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

We have two out of our three Win98SE computers at work that are experiencing those
exact symptoms since installing the update mentioned. Despite some of the claims
here as to the cause, the machines have no malware; are using the latest updated
drivers for sound and video (machines are only a couple of years old); are not using
McAfee or Norton products; and are connected via broadband (RoadRunner) through a
NetGear router. I removed the update and all is well. I await some clarification
from MS.

The WinME computer and all the XP machines in the same network have no problem.
--
Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
~ In memory of our friend, MVP Alex Nichol ~
http://aumha.org/alex.htm
http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm


"Sramic" wrote in message
...
Just on a personal experience note here, ever since I installed these latest
security updates including: "Microsoft Security Bulletin MS05-002
Vulnerability in Cursor and Icon Format Handling Could Allow Remote Code
Execution (891711)"
I have had many blue screens of death to the point of hard rebooting to get
out. It seems that this update is causing me nothing but grief (Win98
3.10.2222, AMD K6-2 450MHz). I am removing this one because I cannot use my
computer with it! Has anyone else experienced this kind of behavior?

"Ivan Bútora" wrote:

Look through some of the recent threats in win98.gen_discussion...

"SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message

...
Whata's the downside of this update?

"Ivan Bútora" wrote in message
...
Dan, please. ANY update is optional. It is up to me if I want to install
it on my machine or not. Yes, I think it's good to install these updates in
general, and I have installed all of them except KB891711. But on the other
hand, there are upsides and downsides. In the case of KB891711, the
inconvenience and trouble that is likely to be caused by this patch is far
greater than the risk of a hacker exploiting your machine. Keep in mind that
there have been several updates this year considered "important" for Windows
98 that have not been released publicly. As Gary Terhune pointed out, the
difference between "important" and "critical" is actually not so significant
in terms of the security threat. So yeah, your machine probably *is*
vulnerable to something. But that's life, you can't be 100% secure all the
time. I don't see the point in making such a big fuss about not having this
one patch installed.

And FYI, since September 2004, my computer has been running WITHOUT
anti-virus protection, anti-spyware, etc. So yesterday I decided I would run
a SpyBot check just for the hell of it, and guess what - nothing found other
than a couple of IE cookies. My point: The most important thing is being
aware of what you're doing with your computer and on the Internet.

Frankly, I don't know what your letter to Bill Gates was, but what I do
know is that MS should be ashamed for releasing a patch in this manner,
without informing the users of the potential caveats, and apparently without
testing in dial-up systems, etc.



"Dan" wrote in message
...
According to PC Today, April issue it is a critical update that has as
of now
not been exploited by hackers. Guys and Gals you need this critical
update
because I am guessing within 3 weeks someone will find a way to
compromise
all 98SE and associated 9x machines that need the patch and have not
been
updated. My best guess is that the time for the hackers will be a
maximum of
3 weeks and it may be even faster so if your machine is connected to the
Internet do whatever it takes to keep "KB891711.EXE" running because I
am
sure down the line Microsoft will be able to do a better fix but this is
a
temporary solution, hopefully to allow users to be safe while on-line.
If
programs are not responding then discover why. People you need this
CRITICAL
PATCH and it is not optional. If Windows will not run with the patch
because
of BSOD then disconnect from the Internet -- remove Ethernet cable, USB
cable
or phone cable until the problem is resolved because if you do not do
this
and have exited this CRITICAL PATCH then you are just asking for your
system
to be hacked and no it will not be by me or my friends although I know a
lot
about security on computers and weak access points and could probably do
it
without too much trouble if I wanted to but my heart is with keeping the
U.S.A and its Allies and businesses and finally consumers to try and get
one
small leg up on the PEOPLE who hack machines for a hobby, the
terriorists and
finally the script kiddies. Let me know how I and others can help you
with
your computer problems. Have a nice day!

"98 Guy" wrote in message ...
:
: If you don't know what I'm talking about, look he
:
: http://www.microsoft.com/technet/sec.../MS05-002.mspx
:
: If you're running Win 98, and have recently (within the past week)
: gone to Windows Updates and updated your computer, you almost
: certainly now have the file "KB891711.EXE" running in the background.
: It is set to run automatically at startup. First time any such update
: or security patch has been configured to operate (instead of simply
: replacing an existing file).
:
: Even though Micro$loth sez that MS05-002 (KB891711.EXE) is critical
: for Win-98, I've read where some (many) people are simply deactivating
: it (via msconfig).
:
: Does anyone really know the truth regarding Win-98 and KB891711.EXE?
:
: Is there anything special about it (like running it in safe mode to
: properly install it) ?
:
: Is it really needed? (for win-98) ?
:
: Is Win-98 really vulnerable to MS05-002 ???





  #23  
Old March 13th 05, 06:45 PM
Sramic
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Glad to hear someone else had similar problems. My video card is
a GeForce 2MX400 with 40.72 vers. Nvidia drivers, there are newer drivers
but they don't work as well on my system.

"glee" wrote:

We have two out of our three Win98SE computers at work that are experiencing those
exact symptoms since installing the update mentioned. Despite some of the claims
here as to the cause, the machines have no malware; are using the latest updated
drivers for sound and video (machines are only a couple of years old); are not using
McAfee or Norton products; and are connected via broadband (RoadRunner) through a
NetGear router. I removed the update and all is well. I await some clarification
from MS.

The WinME computer and all the XP machines in the same network have no problem.
--
Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
~ In memory of our friend, MVP Alex Nichol ~
http://aumha.org/alex.htm
http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm

  #24  
Old March 14th 05, 09:06 PM
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On 03/12/2005 at 11:06 PM, Ivan B=FAtora said:

what I do know is that MS should be ashamed


Of course we know this is an impossibility.

Jim L

--
"Don't call it a crisis until you can't fix it," Obstructionist Party.
  #25  
Old March 14th 05, 09:09 PM
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On 03/12/2005 at 09:50 PM, "Dan" said:

don't come complaining to me later on if someone connects to your
computer and/or network because you were unpatched and makes all kinds
of changes


For god's sake put in a good firewall.

Jim L

--
"Don't call it a crisis until you can't fix it," Obstructionist
Party.
  #26  
Old March 24th 05, 11:39 PM
Gary S. Terhune
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Just read the Win98.Gen_Discussion group, or the WindowsME.General
group, and you'll see several examples of KB891711 causing BSODs.
Believe me, there *is* a problem, and MS *is* working on a solution. The
biggest problem we have, now, is most people who are having trouble with
KB891711 don't seem to be willing to perform some rather simple tests
and return the results.

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
...
Well, we live in an era of 'instant PC Experts'

the typical'my brother in law-sez, ......., and the secretary at

work.....

roof is needed not rumors.

I've had the update for 4 days and nothing has raised an ugly head

yet.

"Dan" wrote in message
...
It is just what people are saying. I don't have any proof.

"SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
...
: Any particular boards?
:
: Is this well founded and some one has absolute proof, or just some

one
: saying it must be ...?
:
: "Dan" wrote in message
: ...
: Read the discussion boards and you will see that it is causing

havoc
with
: some user's machines and associated software and/or hardware.

For
some
of
: the users baddies are definately involved but definately not

with all
the
: users.
:
: "SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
: ...
: : Whata's the downside of this update?
: :
: : "Ivan Bútora" wrote in message
: : ...
: : Dan, please. ANY update is optional. It is up to me if I

want to
: install
: : it on my machine or not. Yes, I think it's good to install

these
updates
: in
: : general, and I have installed all of them except KB891711. But

on
the
: other
: : hand, there are upsides and downsides. In the case of

KB891711, the
: : inconvenience and trouble that is likely to be caused by this

patch
is
: far
: : greater than the risk of a hacker exploiting your machine.

Keep in
mind
: that
: : there have been several updates this year considered

"important" for
: Windows
: : 98 that have not been released publicly. As Gary Terhune

pointed
out,
: the
: : difference between "important" and "critical" is actually not

so
: significant
: : in terms of the security threat. So yeah, your machine

probably *is*
: : vulnerable to something. But that's life, you can't be 100%

secure
all
: the
: : time. I don't see the point in making such a big fuss about

not
having
: this
: : one patch installed.
: :
: : And FYI, since September 2004, my computer has been running

WITHOUT
: : anti-virus protection, anti-spyware, etc. So yesterday I

decided I
would
: run
: : a SpyBot check just for the hell of it, and guess what -

nothing
found
: other
: : than a couple of IE cookies. My point: The most important

thing is
being
: : aware of what you're doing with your computer and on the

Internet.
: :
: : Frankly, I don't know what your letter to Bill Gates was,

but what
I
: do
: : know is that MS should be ashamed for releasing a patch in

this
manner,
: : without informing the users of the potential caveats, and

apparently
: without
: : testing in dial-up systems, etc.
: :
: :
: :
: : "Dan" wrote in message
: : ...
: : According to PC Today, April issue it is a critical update

that
has
: as
: : of now
: : not been exploited by hackers. Guys and Gals you need

this
critical
: : update
: : because I am guessing within 3 weeks someone will find a

way to
: : compromise
: : all 98SE and associated 9x machines that need the patch

and have
not
: : been
: : updated. My best guess is that the time for the hackers

will be
a
: : maximum of
: : 3 weeks and it may be even faster so if your machine is

connected
to
: the
: : Internet do whatever it takes to keep "KB891711.EXE"

running
because
: I
: : am
: : sure down the line Microsoft will be able to do a better

fix but
: this
: is
: : a
: : temporary solution, hopefully to allow users to be safe

while
: on-line.
: : If
: : programs are not responding then discover why. People you

need
this
: : CRITICAL
: : PATCH and it is not optional. If Windows will not run

with the
: patch
: : because
: : of BSOD then disconnect from the Internet -- remove

Ethernet
cable,
: USB
: : cable
: : or phone cable until the problem is resolved because if

you do
not
: do
: : this
: : and have exited this CRITICAL PATCH then you are just

asking for
: your
: : system
: : to be hacked and no it will not be by me or my friends

although
I
: know
: a
: : lot
: : about security on computers and weak access points and

could
: probably
: do
: : it
: : without too much trouble if I wanted to but my heart is

with
keeping
: the
: : U.S.A and its Allies and businesses and finally consumers

to try
and
: get
: : one
: : small leg up on the PEOPLE who hack machines for a hobby,

the
: : terriorists and
: : finally the script kiddies. Let me know how I and others

can
help
: you
: : with
: : your computer problems. Have a nice day!
: :
: : "98 Guy" wrote in message
: ...
: : :
: : : If you don't know what I'm talking about, look he
: : :
: : :

http://www.microsoft.com/technet/sec.../MS05-002.mspx
: : :
: : : If you're running Win 98, and have recently (within the

past
week)
: : : gone to Windows Updates and updated your computer, you

almost
: : : certainly now have the file "KB891711.EXE" running in

the
: background.
: : : It is set to run automatically at startup. First time

any
such
: update
: : : or security patch has been configured to operate

(instead of
: simply
: : : replacing an existing file).
: : :
: : : Even though Micro$loth sez that MS05-002 (KB891711.EXE)

is
: critical
: : : for Win-98, I've read where some (many) people are

simply
: deactivating
: : : it (via msconfig).
: : :
: : : Does anyone really know the truth regarding Win-98 and
: KB891711.EXE?
: : :
: : : Is there anything special about it (like running it in

safe
mode
: to
: : : properly install it) ?
: : :
: : : Is it really needed? (for win-98) ?
: : :
: : : Is Win-98 really vulnerable to MS05-002 ???
: :
: :
: :
:
:
:




  #27  
Old March 24th 05, 11:44 PM
Stan
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Me too. Not a single problem. I'm on dial-up with a 9year old Gateway.

"SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
...
Well, we live in an era of 'instant PC Experts'

the typical'my brother in law-sez, ......., and the secretary at work.....

roof is needed not rumors.

I've had the update for 4 days and nothing has raised an ugly head yet.

"Dan" wrote in message
...
It is just what people are saying. I don't have any proof.

"SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
...
: Any particular boards?
:
: Is this well founded and some one has absolute proof, or just some one
: saying it must be ...?
:
: "Dan" wrote in message
: ...
: Read the discussion boards and you will see that it is causing havoc

with
: some user's machines and associated software and/or hardware. For

some
of
: the users baddies are definately involved but definately not with

all
the
: users.
:
: "SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
: ...
: : Whata's the downside of this update?
: :
: : "Ivan Bútora" wrote in message
: : ...
: : Dan, please. ANY update is optional. It is up to me if I want to
: install
: : it on my machine or not. Yes, I think it's good to install these
updates
: in
: : general, and I have installed all of them except KB891711. But on

the
: other
: : hand, there are upsides and downsides. In the case of KB891711,

the
: : inconvenience and trouble that is likely to be caused by this

patch
is
: far
: : greater than the risk of a hacker exploiting your machine. Keep in

mind
: that
: : there have been several updates this year considered "important"

for
: Windows
: : 98 that have not been released publicly. As Gary Terhune pointed

out,
: the
: : difference between "important" and "critical" is actually not so
: significant
: : in terms of the security threat. So yeah, your machine probably

*is*
: : vulnerable to something. But that's life, you can't be 100% secure

all
: the
: : time. I don't see the point in making such a big fuss about not

having
: this
: : one patch installed.
: :
: : And FYI, since September 2004, my computer has been running

WITHOUT
: : anti-virus protection, anti-spyware, etc. So yesterday I decided I
would
: run
: : a SpyBot check just for the hell of it, and guess what - nothing

found
: other
: : than a couple of IE cookies. My point: The most important thing is
being
: : aware of what you're doing with your computer and on the Internet.
: :
: : Frankly, I don't know what your letter to Bill Gates was, but

what
I
: do
: : know is that MS should be ashamed for releasing a patch in this

manner,
: : without informing the users of the potential caveats, and

apparently
: without
: : testing in dial-up systems, etc.
: :
: :
: :
: : "Dan" wrote in message
: : ...
: : According to PC Today, April issue it is a critical update

that
has
: as
: : of now
: : not been exploited by hackers. Guys and Gals you need this
critical
: : update
: : because I am guessing within 3 weeks someone will find a way

to
: : compromise
: : all 98SE and associated 9x machines that need the patch and

have
not
: : been
: : updated. My best guess is that the time for the hackers will

be
a
: : maximum of
: : 3 weeks and it may be even faster so if your machine is

connected
to
: the
: : Internet do whatever it takes to keep "KB891711.EXE" running
because
: I
: : am
: : sure down the line Microsoft will be able to do a better fix

but
: this
: is
: : a
: : temporary solution, hopefully to allow users to be safe while
: on-line.
: : If
: : programs are not responding then discover why. People you

need
this
: : CRITICAL
: : PATCH and it is not optional. If Windows will not run with

the
: patch
: : because
: : of BSOD then disconnect from the Internet -- remove Ethernet

cable,
: USB
: : cable
: : or phone cable until the problem is resolved because if you do

not
: do
: : this
: : and have exited this CRITICAL PATCH then you are just asking

for
: your
: : system
: : to be hacked and no it will not be by me or my friends

although
I
: know
: a
: : lot
: : about security on computers and weak access points and could
: probably
: do
: : it
: : without too much trouble if I wanted to but my heart is with
keeping
: the
: : U.S.A and its Allies and businesses and finally consumers to

try
and
: get
: : one
: : small leg up on the PEOPLE who hack machines for a hobby, the
: : terriorists and
: : finally the script kiddies. Let me know how I and others can

help
: you
: : with
: : your computer problems. Have a nice day!
: :
: : "98 Guy" wrote in message
: ...
: : :
: : : If you don't know what I'm talking about, look he
: : :
: : :

http://www.microsoft.com/technet/sec.../MS05-002.mspx
: : :
: : : If you're running Win 98, and have recently (within the past
week)
: : : gone to Windows Updates and updated your computer, you

almost
: : : certainly now have the file "KB891711.EXE" running in the
: background.
: : : It is set to run automatically at startup. First time any

such
: update
: : : or security patch has been configured to operate (instead of
: simply
: : : replacing an existing file).
: : :
: : : Even though Micro$loth sez that MS05-002 (KB891711.EXE) is
: critical
: : : for Win-98, I've read where some (many) people are simply
: deactivating
: : : it (via msconfig).
: : :
: : : Does anyone really know the truth regarding Win-98 and
: KB891711.EXE?
: : :
: : : Is there anything special about it (like running it in safe

mode
: to
: : : properly install it) ?
: : :
: : : Is it really needed? (for win-98) ?
: : :
: : : Is Win-98 really vulnerable to MS05-002 ???
: :
: :
: :
:
:
:





  #28  
Old March 24th 05, 11:44 PM
Bill in Co.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

The solution is simple: don't take in all the (supposed) "updates".

Gary S. Terhune wrote:
Just read the Win98.Gen_Discussion group, or the WindowsME.General
group, and you'll see several examples of KB891711 causing BSODs.
Believe me, there *is* a problem, and MS *is* working on a solution. The
biggest problem we have, now, is most people who are having trouble with
KB891711 don't seem to be willing to perform some rather simple tests
and return the results.

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
...
Well, we live in an era of 'instant PC Experts'

the typical'my brother in law-sez, ......., and the secretary at

work.....

roof is needed not rumors.

I've had the update for 4 days and nothing has raised an ugly head yet.

"Dan" wrote in message
...
It is just what people are saying. I don't have any proof.

"SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
...
Any particular boards?

Is this well founded and some one has absolute proof, or just some one
saying it must be ...?

"Dan" wrote in message
...
Read the discussion boards and you will see that it is causing havoc

with
some user's machines and associated software and/or hardware.

For
some
of
the users baddies are definately involved but definately not with all

the
users.

"SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
...
Whata's the downside of this update?

"Ivan Bútora" wrote in message
...
Dan, please. ANY update is optional. It is up to me if I

want to
install
it on my machine or not. Yes, I think it's good to install

these
updates
in
general, and I have installed all of them except KB891711. But

on
the
other
hand, there are upsides and downsides. In the case of KB891711, the
inconvenience and trouble that is likely to be caused by this

patch
is
far
greater than the risk of a hacker exploiting your machine.

Keep in
mind
that
there have been several updates this year considered "important" for
Windows 98 that have not been released publicly. As Gary Terhune

pointed
out,
the
difference between "important" and "critical" is actually not so
significant in terms of the security threat. So yeah, your machine
probably *is* vulnerable to something. But that's life, you can't be

100%
secure
all
the
time. I don't see the point in making such a big fuss about

not
having
this
one patch installed.

And FYI, since September 2004, my computer has been running

WITHOUT
anti-virus protection, anti-spyware, etc. So yesterday I

decided I
would
run
a SpyBot check just for the hell of it, and guess what -

nothing
found
other
than a couple of IE cookies. My point: The most important thing is

being
aware of what you're doing with your computer and on the Internet.

Frankly, I don't know what your letter to Bill Gates was,

but what
I
do
know is that MS should be ashamed for releasing a patch in this

manner,
without informing the users of the potential caveats, and apparently
without testing in dial-up systems, etc.



"Dan" wrote in message
...
According to PC Today, April issue it is a critical update

that
has
as
of now
not been exploited by hackers. Guys and Gals you need

this
critical
update
because I am guessing within 3 weeks someone will find a way to
compromise all 98SE and associated 9x machines that need the patch

and have
not
been
updated. My best guess is that the time for the hackers

will be
a
maximum of
3 weeks and it may be even faster so if your machine is

connected
to
the
Internet do whatever it takes to keep "KB891711.EXE"

running
because
I
am
sure down the line Microsoft will be able to do a better

fix but
this
is
a
temporary solution, hopefully to allow users to be safe

while
on-line.
If
programs are not responding then discover why. People you

need
this
CRITICAL
PATCH and it is not optional. If Windows will not run

with the
patch
because
of BSOD then disconnect from the Internet -- remove

Ethernet
cable,
USB
cable
or phone cable until the problem is resolved because if

you do
not
do
this
and have exited this CRITICAL PATCH then you are just

asking for
your
system
to be hacked and no it will not be by me or my friends

although
I
know
a
lot
about security on computers and weak access points and

could
probably
do
it
without too much trouble if I wanted to but my heart is

with
keeping
the
U.S.A and its Allies and businesses and finally consumers

to try
and
get
one
small leg up on the PEOPLE who hack machines for a hobby, the
terriorists and finally the script kiddies. Let me know how I and
others

can
help
you
with
your computer problems. Have a nice day!

"98 Guy" wrote in message
...

If you don't know what I'm talking about, look he


http://www.microsoft.com/technet/sec.../MS05-002.mspx

If you're running Win 98, and have recently (within the past week)
gone to Windows Updates and updated your computer, you almost
certainly now have the file "KB891711.EXE" running in the

background.
It is set to run automatically at startup. First time

any
such
update
or security patch has been configured to operate (instead of

simply
replacing an existing file).

Even though Micro$loth sez that MS05-002 (KB891711.EXE) is

critical
for Win-98, I've read where some (many) people are simply

deactivating
it (via msconfig).

Does anyone really know the truth regarding Win-98 and

KB891711.EXE?

Is there anything special about it (like running it in

safe
mode
to
properly install it) ?

Is it really needed? (for win-98) ?

Is Win-98 really vulnerable to MS05-002 ???



  #29  
Old March 25th 05, 12:48 AM
SFB - KB3MM
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

No BSOD here, but what is/are the simple test(s)?


"Bill in Co." wrote in message
...
The solution is simple: don't take in all the (supposed) "updates".

Gary S. Terhune wrote:
Just read the Win98.Gen_Discussion group, or the WindowsME.General
group, and you'll see several examples of KB891711 causing BSODs.
Believe me, there *is* a problem, and MS *is* working on a solution. The
biggest problem we have, now, is most people who are having trouble with
KB891711 don't seem to be willing to perform some rather simple tests
and return the results.

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
...
Well, we live in an era of 'instant PC Experts'

the typical'my brother in law-sez, ......., and the secretary at

work.....

roof is needed not rumors.

I've had the update for 4 days and nothing has raised an ugly head yet.

"Dan" wrote in message
...
It is just what people are saying. I don't have any proof.

"SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
...
Any particular boards?

Is this well founded and some one has absolute proof, or just some

one
saying it must be ...?

"Dan" wrote in message
...
Read the discussion boards and you will see that it is causing havoc

with
some user's machines and associated software and/or hardware.

For
some
of
the users baddies are definately involved but definately not with

all
the
users.

"SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
...
Whata's the downside of this update?

"Ivan Bútora" wrote in message
...
Dan, please. ANY update is optional. It is up to me if I

want to
install
it on my machine or not. Yes, I think it's good to install

these
updates
in
general, and I have installed all of them except KB891711. But

on
the
other
hand, there are upsides and downsides. In the case of KB891711, the
inconvenience and trouble that is likely to be caused by this

patch
is
far
greater than the risk of a hacker exploiting your machine.

Keep in
mind
that
there have been several updates this year considered "important"

for
Windows 98 that have not been released publicly. As Gary Terhune

pointed
out,
the
difference between "important" and "critical" is actually not so
significant in terms of the security threat. So yeah, your machine
probably *is* vulnerable to something. But that's life, you can't

be
100%
secure
all
the
time. I don't see the point in making such a big fuss about

not
having
this
one patch installed.

And FYI, since September 2004, my computer has been running
WITHOUT
anti-virus protection, anti-spyware, etc. So yesterday I

decided I
would
run
a SpyBot check just for the hell of it, and guess what -

nothing
found
other
than a couple of IE cookies. My point: The most important thing is

being
aware of what you're doing with your computer and on the Internet.

Frankly, I don't know what your letter to Bill Gates was,

but what
I
do
know is that MS should be ashamed for releasing a patch in this

manner,
without informing the users of the potential caveats, and

apparently
without testing in dial-up systems, etc.



"Dan" wrote in message
...
According to PC Today, April issue it is a critical update

that
has
as
of now
not been exploited by hackers. Guys and Gals you need

this
critical
update
because I am guessing within 3 weeks someone will find a way to
compromise all 98SE and associated 9x machines that need the

patch
and have
not
been
updated. My best guess is that the time for the hackers

will be
a
maximum of
3 weeks and it may be even faster so if your machine is
connected
to
the
Internet do whatever it takes to keep "KB891711.EXE"

running
because
I
am
sure down the line Microsoft will be able to do a better

fix but
this
is
a
temporary solution, hopefully to allow users to be safe

while
on-line.
If
programs are not responding then discover why. People you

need
this
CRITICAL
PATCH and it is not optional. If Windows will not run

with the
patch
because
of BSOD then disconnect from the Internet -- remove

Ethernet
cable,
USB
cable
or phone cable until the problem is resolved because if

you do
not
do
this
and have exited this CRITICAL PATCH then you are just

asking for
your
system
to be hacked and no it will not be by me or my friends

although
I
know
a
lot
about security on computers and weak access points and

could
probably
do
it
without too much trouble if I wanted to but my heart is

with
keeping
the
U.S.A and its Allies and businesses and finally consumers

to try
and
get
one
small leg up on the PEOPLE who hack machines for a hobby, the
terriorists and finally the script kiddies. Let me know how I

and
others

can
help
you
with
your computer problems. Have a nice day!

"98 Guy" wrote in message
...

If you don't know what I'm talking about, look he


http://www.microsoft.com/technet/sec.../MS05-002.mspx

If you're running Win 98, and have recently (within the past

week)
gone to Windows Updates and updated your computer, you almost
certainly now have the file "KB891711.EXE" running in the

background.
It is set to run automatically at startup. First time

any
such
update
or security patch has been configured to operate (instead of

simply
replacing an existing file).

Even though Micro$loth sez that MS05-002 (KB891711.EXE) is

critical
for Win-98, I've read where some (many) people are simply

deactivating
it (via msconfig).

Does anyone really know the truth regarding Win-98 and

KB891711.EXE?

Is there anything special about it (like running it in

safe
mode
to
properly install it) ?

Is it really needed? (for win-98) ?

Is Win-98 really vulnerable to MS05-002 ???




  #30  
Old March 25th 05, 01:22 AM
Gary S. Terhune
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

You think that's a simple one, eh?

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Bill in Co." wrote in message
...
The solution is simple: don't take in all the (supposed) "updates".

Gary S. Terhune wrote:
Just read the Win98.Gen_Discussion group, or the WindowsME.General
group, and you'll see several examples of KB891711 causing BSODs.
Believe me, there *is* a problem, and MS *is* working on a solution.

The
biggest problem we have, now, is most people who are having trouble

with
KB891711 don't seem to be willing to perform some rather simple

tests
and return the results.

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
...
Well, we live in an era of 'instant PC Experts'

the typical'my brother in law-sez, ......., and the secretary at

work.....

roof is needed not rumors.

I've had the update for 4 days and nothing has raised an ugly head

yet.

"Dan" wrote in message
...
It is just what people are saying. I don't have any proof.

"SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
...
Any particular boards?

Is this well founded and some one has absolute proof, or just

some one
saying it must be ...?

"Dan" wrote in message
...
Read the discussion boards and you will see that it is causing

havoc
with
some user's machines and associated software and/or hardware.

For
some
of
the users baddies are definately involved but definately not

with all
the
users.

"SFB - KB3MM" wrote in message
...
Whata's the downside of this update?

"Ivan Bútora" wrote in message
...
Dan, please. ANY update is optional. It is up to me if I

want to
install
it on my machine or not. Yes, I think it's good to install

these
updates
in
general, and I have installed all of them except KB891711. But

on
the
other
hand, there are upsides and downsides. In the case of KB891711,

the
inconvenience and trouble that is likely to be caused by this

patch
is
far
greater than the risk of a hacker exploiting your machine.

Keep in
mind
that
there have been several updates this year considered

"important" for
Windows 98 that have not been released publicly. As Gary

Terhune
pointed
out,
the
difference between "important" and "critical" is actually not

so
significant in terms of the security threat. So yeah, your

machine
probably *is* vulnerable to something. But that's life, you

can't be
100%
secure
all
the
time. I don't see the point in making such a big fuss about

not
having
this
one patch installed.

And FYI, since September 2004, my computer has been running
WITHOUT
anti-virus protection, anti-spyware, etc. So yesterday I

decided I
would
run
a SpyBot check just for the hell of it, and guess what -

nothing
found
other
than a couple of IE cookies. My point: The most important thing

is
being
aware of what you're doing with your computer and on the

Internet.

Frankly, I don't know what your letter to Bill Gates was,

but what
I
do
know is that MS should be ashamed for releasing a patch in this

manner,
without informing the users of the potential caveats, and

apparently
without testing in dial-up systems, etc.



"Dan" wrote in message
...
According to PC Today, April issue it is a critical update

that
has
as
of now
not been exploited by hackers. Guys and Gals you need

this
critical
update
because I am guessing within 3 weeks someone will find a way

to
compromise all 98SE and associated 9x machines that need the

patch
and have
not
been
updated. My best guess is that the time for the hackers

will be
a
maximum of
3 weeks and it may be even faster so if your machine is
connected
to
the
Internet do whatever it takes to keep "KB891711.EXE"

running
because
I
am
sure down the line Microsoft will be able to do a better

fix but
this
is
a
temporary solution, hopefully to allow users to be safe

while
on-line.
If
programs are not responding then discover why. People you

need
this
CRITICAL
PATCH and it is not optional. If Windows will not run

with the
patch
because
of BSOD then disconnect from the Internet -- remove

Ethernet
cable,
USB
cable
or phone cable until the problem is resolved because if

you do
not
do
this
and have exited this CRITICAL PATCH then you are just

asking for
your
system
to be hacked and no it will not be by me or my friends

although
I
know
a
lot
about security on computers and weak access points and

could
probably
do
it
without too much trouble if I wanted to but my heart is

with
keeping
the
U.S.A and its Allies and businesses and finally consumers

to try
and
get
one
small leg up on the PEOPLE who hack machines for a hobby, the
terriorists and finally the script kiddies. Let me know how

I and
others

can
help
you
with
your computer problems. Have a nice day!

"98 Guy" wrote in message
...

If you don't know what I'm talking about, look he


http://www.microsoft.com/technet/sec.../MS05-002.mspx

If you're running Win 98, and have recently (within the past

week)
gone to Windows Updates and updated your computer, you

almost
certainly now have the file "KB891711.EXE" running in the

background.
It is set to run automatically at startup. First time

any
such
update
or security patch has been configured to operate (instead of

simply
replacing an existing file).

Even though Micro$loth sez that MS05-002 (KB891711.EXE) is

critical
for Win-98, I've read where some (many) people are simply

deactivating
it (via msconfig).

Does anyone really know the truth regarding Win-98 and

KB891711.EXE?

Is there anything special about it (like running it in

safe
mode
to
properly install it) ?

Is it really needed? (for win-98) ?

Is Win-98 really vulnerable to MS05-002 ???




 




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