No 98SE 'AutoScan' options

"Bill Blanton" wrote in message
...
|
| "PCR" wrote in message
...
| "Bill Blanton" wrote in message
| ...
| | "PCR" wrote in message
| ...
| | "Bill Blanton" wrote in message
| | ...
| |
| |
|
| | Register: 10000000 00000000 Value: 32,768, if that isn't a
sign bit
| | Memory: 00000000 10000000 Value: 128
| |
| | 128 is not the value if you consider this bit string as a word
in
| | memory. It is still 32,768 (assuming no sign-bit)
|
| 128 is the value of those bits, considered as just a string of
binary
| bits-- & NOT considering what the processor may do to them before it
| decides their value.
|
| Yep. So why did you include the leading byte? I assumed you meant to
| show a word. And the value is in Memory: from your chart. Value. "The
| amount denoted by a term; a magnitude, quantity, or number.." The
value
| does not change if it is stroed "backwards", and part of the equation
| includes little endian "terms" that define how to equate the value.

I was still trying to deny that one must do as the processor does &
mentally reverse bytes before interpreting them.

|
| If number of bytes of a value is 1
| then [ValueStartByteMemAddress+x] = byte[x]
|
| IOW [byte ptr address+0]=byte[0] {low order}
|
| That doesn't change the value, it just means you have to work through
| the little endian equation to get the correct result. Otherwise,
you'll
| come up with an incorrect value.

OK, fine. BUT, I'd definitely look for an assembler or higher order
language to do it for me.

|
|
| | Regarding the reversed field, it has a different number in it,
until it
| | is reversed again when read (if that really happens). This is
true,
| | UNLESS there is absolutely no way to operate upon the number
except
| | through the "architecture".
| |
| | How else are you going to read a value stored in memory or
| | on disk, but through the processor?
|
| Conceivably, one may produce a Debug dump as you did elsewhere, then
| parse the bits out of it. Now you've got the reversed bytes.
|
| Yeah, you can parse out bits, bytes, words, etc.. but you've
| intentionally broken the full value in doing so. You can do
| the same with big-endian.
|
| word = 0x1234
| parse out the low byte 0x34
| So what does that mean? I've extracted a byte from a word. It isn't
| the same value, obviously, but I ignored the "rules". If you want to
| parse them out and put them back together again later, then yes you
| have to be aware of the system.

Fine. I was still in denial.

|
|
| | | It does take some getting used to..I still sometimes look at a
| | | little endian number and then... oh yeah..
| |
| | Is it true of a string of characters as well as numbers, that
they are
| | stored right to left? Have they turned the computer totally into
a
| | Chinaman?
| |
| | Ascii character strings are comprised of 1 byte values, and so are
| | not affected, and if you look at a string in storage it is
"readable".
| | When you read a string, you generally retrieve a byte at a time.
| |
| | Unicode chars are 2 bytes wide and the bytes within each char are
| | reversed. It's still fairly "readable" to the eye though.
(assuming
| | a latin based language) Doing a memory dump of 'ABC' you might see
| | 'A' 00 'B' 00 'C' 00
| | When in reality the code for 'A' would be 00'A'
|
|
| Well, as characters & numbers follow the same rules, I suppose the
| processor has redefined left/right. But it didn't go all the way,
| because it isn't done within a byte. So, in the case of a single
byte,
| the leftmost bit is the high-order bit still. I suppose I'll have to
be
| content with that. OK, then.
|
| :-)

:-). I apologize for my stubbornness on this issue, & thanks for
sticking with me.

--
Thanks or Good Luck,
There may be humor in this post, and,
Naturally, you will not sue,
should things get worse after this,
PCR

"Bill Blanton" wrote in message
...
| "PCR" wrote in message
...
| "Bill Blanton" wrote in message
| ...
| ...snip
| |
| | Well, if this is the FAT Entry...
| |
| | x'00 00 00 03', or
| | b'00000000 00000000 00000000 00000011'
| |
| | The '11' in your bit stream is not the high 2 bits of a 28 bit
| | value. It's the two higher bits (to the left)
| |
| | Actually I said, FF FF FF 03, to show both error flags clear.
|
| I couldn't quite make out what "clear" meant. I was confused
because, as
| you quote the FAT spec below: "If bit is 0, volume is 'dirty'. " I
| mistakenly thought by "clear" you meant "clean".
|
| Yeah, that is somewhat confusing. Most code set a flag, by setting
| a bit, not clearing it. That could be a backward compatibility issue.
| Most times (when clean) it would be in a "familiar" state, with all
| 28 bits set. FF FF FF 0F.

Absolutely it is more normal to set than to clear. But, after all, these
are little-endian minds at work. So...

|
| |
| | This is the actual 32 bit value, after it's moved into a CPU
register
| | where the flags can be checked. 0x03FFFFFF
| |
| | FAT32 only use 28 bits (7 nybbles)
|
| Fine. A FAT Entry is 28 bits.
|
| | 0x3FFFFFFF is all it uses.
|
| For some reason, it drops the high-order (my meaning-- leftmost)
nibble
| of a double-word when dealing with a FAT Entry, probably to save
space.
|
| Well it doesn't save space on the disk, and the CPU must load the
| whole dword. I don't know why they didn't make FAT"28" a true 32 bits
| wide. Maybe because of 28-bit LBA? After all there's no need to try
| to access more clusters (assuming a theoretical 512 byte clusters, on
| \a 128GB disk) if hardware (at the time) won't support it..But it's
| more work to parse out the high nybble of a dword, than to use the
dword
| directly.. dunno..

Very odd, then, if it wasn't to save space somewhere/somehow.

|
|
|
| | This is binary with the unused high nybble stripped.
| | 0011 11111111 11111111 11111111
|
| YOU call it a high-order nibble? Oh, oh, that's right, this is how
the
| architecture presents the number to us when displaying the contents
a
| register. BUT the nibble is certainly in a different position in
memory,
| where bytes are written right to left. AND, you still will call it
the
| high-order one there, in memory.
|
| Yep.

OK.

--
Thanks or Good Luck,
There may be humor in this post, and,
Naturally, you will not sue,
should things get worse after this,
PCR

"PCR" wrote in message ...
"Bill Blanton" wrote in message
...


| Value. "The
| amount denoted by a term; a magnitude, quantity, or number.." The value
| does not change if it is stroed "backwards", and part of the equation
| includes little endian "terms" that define how to equate the value.

I was still trying to deny that one must do as the processor does &
mentally reverse bytes before interpreting them.


OK, fine. BUT, I'd definitely look for an assembler or higher order
language to do it for me.


Fine.. It's settled then. You must start breaking your eggs on the
little end..

I have so instructed the butler, & it's working it's way down to the
cooks. OK, bye.

--
Thanks or Good Luck,
There may be humor in this post, and,
Naturally, you will not sue,
should things get worse after this,
PCR

"Bill Blanton" wrote in message
...
|
| "PCR" wrote in message
...
| "Bill Blanton" wrote in message
| ...
|
|
| | Value. "The
| | amount denoted by a term; a magnitude, quantity, or number.." The
value
| | does not change if it is stroed "backwards", and part of the
equation
| | includes little endian "terms" that define how to equate the
value.
|
| I was still trying to deny that one must do as the processor does &
| mentally reverse bytes before interpreting them.
|
|
| OK, fine. BUT, I'd definitely look for an assembler or higher order
| language to do it for me.
|
|
| Fine.. It's settled then. You must start breaking your eggs on the
| little end..
|
|
|

"Kentiguous" wrote in message
...
| PCR wrote :
| }"Kentiguous" wrote in message
| ...
| }| PCR wrote :
| }| "Kentiguous" wrote in message
| }| ...
| }| | PCR wrote :
| }| | "Kentiguous" wrote in message
| }| | ...
| }| WIN.COM is the DOS executable file that starts the process of
loading
| }| Windows. I don't think that it's quite accurate to say that it 'is
| }| Windows', though. And, I'm willing to bet (a whole bushel of bytes
| }| g)
| }| that it is, indeed, WIN.COM that's auto-running SCANDISK (IO.SYS
may
| }| be
| }| doing the actual 'byte checking', beforehand, though; I don't
know).
| }| OSR2.x was Win95 B + C (SCANDISK didn't auto-run in earlier
versions
| }| of 95).
|
| }Yea, there is truth in what you say. I guess I was thinking, after
| }Win.com executes, there is only Windows left. Therefore,
| }Win.com=Windows. HOWEVER, Auto-Scandisk does not have a Windows look
to
| }it. And we know it honor Scandisk.ini, which the Windows version will
| }not.
|
| It looks to me like WIN.COM does the auto-running, before making the
| switch to Windows.
|
| }Therefore, either it is as you say, or IO.sys will run the Auto
before
| }the DOS command Win.com is issued.
|
| There are no commands to run SCANDISK in IO.SYS, here (Win98SE). It's
| possible that there are encrypted commands, but I doubt it very much.
|
| Do an "EDIT/78 \Windows\WIN.COM", and you'll see the references to
| SCANDISK.

"START, Find, F/F" also works...

Named: IO.sys, Win.com (Include the comma.)
Containing Text: Scandisk

....FINDS only Win.com. Therefore, it may well be as you said, that
Win.com does it.

Anyway, I have now set nearly everything in Scandisk.ini to "On" or
"Prompt" as a final punishment for the lack of knowledge I have
displayed in this thread. And I will not change them back without
express permission from you & Blanton, unless, of course, cquirke should
happen by to give me a pardon!

|
| Ken
|
|
| --
| Remove the '4' to reply via email

--
Thanks or Good Luck,
There may be humor in this post, and,
Naturally, you will not sue,
should things get worse after this,
PCR

"PCR" wrote in message ...
"Kentiguous" wrote in message
...

| It looks to me like WIN.COM does the auto-running, before making the
| switch to Windows.

| There are no commands to run SCANDISK in IO.SYS, here (Win98SE). It's
| possible that there are encrypted commands, but I doubt it very much.
|
| Do an "EDIT/78 \Windows\WIN.COM", and you'll see the references to
| SCANDISK.

"START, Find, F/F" also works...

Named: IO.sys, Win.com (Include the comma.)
Containing Text: Scandisk

...FINDS only Win.com. Therefore, it may well be as you said, that
Win.com does it.

That makes sense as IO.SYS has no need to check, since autorunning
of Scandisk is a Windows specific task. Msdos.sys must also be parsed,
another Windows task.


Anyway, I have now set nearly everything in Scandisk.ini to "On" or
"Prompt" as a final punishment for the lack of knowledge I have
displayed in this thread. And I will not change them back without
express permission from you & Blanton, unless, of course, cquirke should
happen by to give me a pardon!

Maybe worth mentioning. Scandisk.ini needs to be in the %path% for
the /custom switch to recognize it. Otherwise it's "auto-fix". I've had
this bite me before when running a scandisk /custom after a floppy
boot. I haven't really tested that thoroughly, but iirc it doesn't
matter that scandisk.ini is in the same dir as the called scandisk.exe
either.

I.e. boot from a floppy and run c:\windows\command\scandisk /custom
If "..\command" isn't in the %path% it won't honor your settings.

"Bill Blanton" wrote in message
...
| "PCR" wrote in message
...
| "Kentiguous" wrote in message
| ...
|
| | It looks to me like WIN.COM does the auto-running, before making
the
| | switch to Windows.
|
| | There are no commands to run SCANDISK in IO.SYS, here (Win98SE).
It's
| | possible that there are encrypted commands, but I doubt it very
much.
| |
| | Do an "EDIT/78 \Windows\WIN.COM", and you'll see the references to
| | SCANDISK.
|
| "START, Find, F/F" also works...
|
| Named: IO.sys, Win.com (Include the comma.)
| Containing Text: Scandisk
|
| ...FINDS only Win.com. Therefore, it may well be as you said, that
| Win.com does it.
|
| That makes sense as IO.SYS has no need to check, since autorunning
| of Scandisk is a Windows specific task.

That does seem to make sense. It was that revised, "Badour" article
causing a doubt...

........Quote..................
OSR2 includes versions of the Io.sys and Win.com files that check the
Clean Shutdown and Hard Disk Error bits in the Virtual File Allocation
Table (VFAT) during startup.
........EOQ....................

| Msdos.sys must also be parsed, another Windows task.

I think MSDOS.sys is pre-Windows & is pure DOS.

|
|
| Anyway, I have now set nearly everything in Scandisk.ini to "On" or
| "Prompt" as a final punishment for the lack of knowledge I have
| displayed in this thread. And I will not change them back without
| express permission from you & Blanton, unless, of course, cquirke
should
| happen by to give me a pardon!
|
| Maybe worth mentioning. Scandisk.ini needs to be in the %path% for
| the /custom switch to recognize it. Otherwise it's "auto-fix". I've
had
| this bite me before when running a scandisk /custom after a floppy
| boot. I haven't really tested that thoroughly, but iirc it doesn't
| matter that scandisk.ini is in the same dir as the called scandisk.exe
| either.

Very informative. It might have been quite a puzzle to me. Normally, of
course, C:\Windows\Command is in the Path after Config.sys/Autoexec.bat
are run. It seems especially odd that the .ini will not work from in the
folder of Scandisk. Perhaps that is just a privelidge of .dll's, though.

|
| I.e. boot from a floppy and run c:\windows\command\scandisk /custom
| If "..\command" isn't in the %path% it won't honor your settings.

--
Thanks or Good Luck,
There may be humor in this post, and,
Naturally, you will not sue,
should things get worse after this,
PCR

MS-DOS is pure DOS, PCR. :

"PCR" wrote in message
...
: "Bill Blanton" wrote in message
: ...
: | "PCR" wrote in message
: ...
: | "Kentiguous" wrote in message
: | ...
: |
: | | It looks to me like WIN.COM does the auto-running, before making
: the
: | | switch to Windows.
: |
: | | There are no commands to run SCANDISK in IO.SYS, here (Win98SE).
: It's
: | | possible that there are encrypted commands, but I doubt it very
: much.
: | |
: | | Do an "EDIT/78 \Windows\WIN.COM", and you'll see the references to
: | | SCANDISK.
: |
: | "START, Find, F/F" also works...
: |
: | Named: IO.sys, Win.com (Include the comma.)
: | Containing Text: Scandisk
: |
: | ...FINDS only Win.com. Therefore, it may well be as you said, that
: | Win.com does it.
: |
: | That makes sense as IO.SYS has no need to check, since autorunning
: | of Scandisk is a Windows specific task.
:
: That does seem to make sense. It was that revised, "Badour" article
: causing a doubt...
:
: .......Quote..................
: OSR2 includes versions of the Io.sys and Win.com files that check the
: Clean Shutdown and Hard Disk Error bits in the Virtual File Allocation
: Table (VFAT) during startup.
: .......EOQ....................
:
: | Msdos.sys must also be parsed, another Windows task.
:
: I think MSDOS.sys is pre-Windows & is pure DOS.
:
: |
: |
: | Anyway, I have now set nearly everything in Scandisk.ini to "On" or
: | "Prompt" as a final punishment for the lack of knowledge I have
: | displayed in this thread. And I will not change them back without
: | express permission from you & Blanton, unless, of course, cquirke
: should
: | happen by to give me a pardon!
: |
: | Maybe worth mentioning. Scandisk.ini needs to be in the %path% for
: | the /custom switch to recognize it. Otherwise it's "auto-fix". I've
: had
: | this bite me before when running a scandisk /custom after a floppy
: | boot. I haven't really tested that thoroughly, but iirc it doesn't
: | matter that scandisk.ini is in the same dir as the called scandisk.exe
: | either.
:
: Very informative. It might have been quite a puzzle to me. Normally, of
: course, C:\Windows\Command is in the Path after Config.sys/Autoexec.bat
: are run. It seems especially odd that the .ini will not work from in the
: folder of Scandisk. Perhaps that is just a privelidge of .dll's, though.
:
: |
: | I.e. boot from a floppy and run c:\windows\command\scandisk /custom
: | If "..\command" isn't in the %path% it won't honor your settings.
:
: --
: Thanks or Good Luck,
: There may be humor in this post, and,
: Naturally, you will not sue,
: should things get worse after this,
: PCR
:
:
:

Right. All DOS are pure DOS, except Windows DOS (in a box). OK, then.

--
Thanks or Good Luck,
There may be humor in this post, and,
Naturally, you will not sue,
should things get worse after this,
PCR

"Dan" wrote in message
...
| MS-DOS is pure DOS, PCR. :
|
| "PCR" wrote in message
| ...
| : "Bill Blanton" wrote in message
| : ...
| : | "PCR" wrote in message
| : ...
| : | "Kentiguous" wrote in message
| : | ...
| : |
| : | | It looks to me like WIN.COM does the auto-running, before
making
| : the
| : | | switch to Windows.
| : |
| : | | There are no commands to run SCANDISK in IO.SYS, here
(Win98SE).
| : It's
| : | | possible that there are encrypted commands, but I doubt it
very
| : much.
| : | |
| : | | Do an "EDIT/78 \Windows\WIN.COM", and you'll see the
references to
| : | | SCANDISK.
| : |
| : | "START, Find, F/F" also works...
| : |
| : | Named: IO.sys, Win.com (Include the comma.)
| : | Containing Text: Scandisk
| : |
| : | ...FINDS only Win.com. Therefore, it may well be as you said,
that
| : | Win.com does it.
| : |
| : | That makes sense as IO.SYS has no need to check, since autorunning
| : | of Scandisk is a Windows specific task.
| :
| : That does seem to make sense. It was that revised, "Badour" article
| : causing a doubt...
| :
| : .......Quote..................
| : OSR2 includes versions of the Io.sys and Win.com files that check
the
| : Clean Shutdown and Hard Disk Error bits in the Virtual File
Allocation
| : Table (VFAT) during startup.
| : .......EOQ....................
| :
| : | Msdos.sys must also be parsed, another Windows task.
| :
| : I think MSDOS.sys is pre-Windows & is pure DOS.
| :
| : |
| : |
| : | Anyway, I have now set nearly everything in Scandisk.ini to "On"
or
| : | "Prompt" as a final punishment for the lack of knowledge I have
| : | displayed in this thread. And I will not change them back
without
| : | express permission from you & Blanton, unless, of course,
cquirke
| : should
| : | happen by to give me a pardon!
| : |
| : | Maybe worth mentioning. Scandisk.ini needs to be in the %path% for
| : | the /custom switch to recognize it. Otherwise it's "auto-fix".
I've
| : had
| : | this bite me before when running a scandisk /custom after a floppy
| : | boot. I haven't really tested that thoroughly, but iirc it doesn't
| : | matter that scandisk.ini is in the same dir as the called
scandisk.exe
| : | either.
| :
| : Very informative. It might have been quite a puzzle to me. Normally,
of
| : course, C:\Windows\Command is in the Path after
Config.sys/Autoexec.bat
| : are run. It seems especially odd that the .ini will not work from in
the
| : folder of Scandisk. Perhaps that is just a privelidge of .dll's,
though.
| :
| : |
| : | I.e. boot from a floppy and run c:\windows\command\scandisk
/custom
| : | If "..\command" isn't in the %path% it won't honor your settings.
| :
| : --
| : Thanks or Good Luck,
| : There may be humor in this post, and,
| : Naturally, you will not sue,
| : should things get worse after this,
| : PCR
| :
| :
| :
|
|

"Kentiguous" wrote in message ...
Bill Blanton wrote :
}
}"Kentiguous" wrote in message
...
} Bill Blanton wrote :
} }
} }"Kentiguous" wrote in message
} ...
} Thanks for confirming the Diskedit results, Bill (and the location).
} Would I be correct in assuming that byte 3 (zero-based), bits
} 14+15 (zero-based) would hold the flags, on an appropriate FAT16
} system
} volume (in Diskedit's 'hex view' mode)?
}
}Yes, bits 14 & 15 of the word. (but byte[1], not byte[3]
}(8 bits in a byte)

But, wouldn't it be the second FAT entry (as per FAT32) ?

Yes. ClusterPtr[1], [0-based].

I thought you meant byte 3 within the entry, which wouldn't
exist in a word. But yes, it is the fourth counted byte
into the FAT. Or FAT_Offest+3

F8 FF - FF FF
F8 FF - FF 7F
F8 FF - FF BF
F8 FF - FF 3F