What's the deal with MS05-002 (KB891711.EXE) and Windows 98?

cquirke (MVP Windows shell/user) wrote:

More on that, please? Which two .DLL files?

cquirke, if you can find a way to solve this problem without having to swap
to the old 5.5 dlls and what that means, you will be W9x's official grand
hero! vbg

The problem is real and is a royal p.i.t.a ..I get around it by holding the
Shift key when I want to delete anything out of the ordinary - and that seems
to keep me out of the problem, but I would really like to get this fixed
correctly once and for all !

I've seen the work you did with the TS-BATS setup you made for parallel
installs and what that represented in know-how for you to do that, and other
things, and so I'm complementing you forward to see if you can resolves this
issue for us too.

Rick

cquirke (MVP Windows shell/user) wrote:

More on that, please? Which two .DLL files?

cquirke, if you can find a way to solve this problem without having to swap
to the old 5.5 dlls and what that means, you will be W9x's official grand
hero! vbg

The problem is real and is a royal p.i.t.a ..I get around it by holding the
Shift key when I want to delete anything out of the ordinary - and that seems
to keep me out of the problem, but I would really like to get this fixed
correctly once and for all !

I've seen the work you did with the TS-BATS setup you made for parallel
installs and what that represented in know-how for you to do that, and other
things, and so I'm complementing you forward to see if you can resolves this
issue for us too.

Rick

OK. But I'm thinking a WEB site can get one infected or otherwise be
malicious in a many ways.

--
Thanks or Good Luck,
There may be humor in this post, and,
Naturally, you will not sue,
should things get worse after this,
PCR

"cquirke (MVP Windows shell/user)" wrote
in message ...
| On Fri, 25 Mar 2005 00:05:40 -0500, "PCR" wrote:
|
| Also, I'm sure, some of the security "flaws" MS are always fixing
| don't need a virus to cause harm, but just a malicious WEB site.
|
| Read between the lines - for "web site", usually that means HTML, and
| that can include unsolicited email "message text".
|
|
|
| ---------- ----- ---- --- -- - - - -
| Gone to bloggery: http://cquirke.blogspot.com
| ---------- ----- ---- --- -- - - - -

But the issue has been effectively resolved, for all "practical purposes",
by swapping those two DLL files (IMO). Works GREAT over here!

Rick Chauvin wrote:
cquirke (MVP Windows shell/user) wrote:

More on that, please? Which two .DLL files?

cquirke, if you can find a way to solve this problem without having to
swap
to the old 5.5 dlls and what that means, you will be W9x's official grand
hero! vbg

The problem is real and is a royal p.i.t.a ..I get around it by holding
the
Shift key when I want to delete anything out of the ordinary - and that
seems
to keep me out of the problem, but I would really like to get this fixed
correctly once and for all !

I've seen the work you did with the TS-BATS setup you made for parallel
installs and what that represented in know-how for you to do that, and
other
things, and so I'm complementing you forward to see if you can resolves
this
issue for us too.

Rick

But the issue has been effectively resolved, for all "practical purposes",
by swapping those two DLL files (IMO). Works GREAT over here!

Rick Chauvin wrote:
cquirke (MVP Windows shell/user) wrote:

More on that, please? Which two .DLL files?

cquirke, if you can find a way to solve this problem without having to
swap
to the old 5.5 dlls and what that means, you will be W9x's official grand
hero! vbg

The problem is real and is a royal p.i.t.a ..I get around it by holding
the
Shift key when I want to delete anything out of the ordinary - and that
seems
to keep me out of the problem, but I would really like to get this fixed
correctly once and for all !

I've seen the work you did with the TS-BATS setup you made for parallel
installs and what that represented in know-how for you to do that, and
other
things, and so I'm complementing you forward to see if you can resolves
this
issue for us too.

Rick

You are right; timing is everything, & a good virus scan before doing
the backup could also be helpful, if not infallible. I suppose the best
protection would be to keep a bootable partition totally off of the NET,
but that can't be an easy option for everyone. Also, it, too, wouldn't
be infallible.


--
Thanks or Good Luck,
There may be humor in this post, and,
Naturally, you will not sue,
should things get worse after this,
PCR

"cquirke (MVP Windows shell/user)" wrote
in message ...
| On Fri, 25 Mar 2005 00:42:47 -0500, "PCR" wrote:
|
| I would go for my full system backup in that circumstance. Although
I've
| created a ton of partitions now, still I'm not that complex to
restore.
| Good for you, though, to beat them in hand to hand combat, Colorado.
|
| (referring to "difficult" malware)
|
| At a basic theory level, the concept of "backup" is inherently broken:
| - retain all wanted changes
| - lose all unwanted changes
|
| On what magical basis is "backup" supposed to separate these, before
| you know what these unwanted changes are?
|
| The answer is, dividing content by scope, so as to include all wanted
| changes and exclude all unwanted changes. The classic scope is that
| universal X-axis; time. You make your full system backup before
| unwanted changes occur, and before you create further wanted changes.
|
| Then when you have a problem, you restore that backup, losing no
| wanted changes but losing all unwanted changes.
|
| That's how I use SR (System Restore) when I'm about to do something I
| know is risky, such as upgrade a Windows subsystem like DirectX when I
| don't trust it will have a clean and effective uninstaller.
|
| But it is the nature of malware to confound time-scoped backups. The
| malware typically arrives without drawing attention to itself, is
| incorporated into your full system backups, and only later (after
| creating many wanted changes) do you realize you have a problem.
|
| How does your "full system backup" magically fix that?
|
|
|
| ---------- ----- ---- --- -- - - - -
| Gone to bloggery: http://cquirke.blogspot.com
| ---------- ----- ---- --- -- - - - -

Naturally, I, too, have only ever insulted Terhune entirely by accident.
And the day his Poodles fail to catch him by the toes toppling into an
earthquake, I will be the FIRST to write his obituary!

OK, then. Just, keep your most important stuff isolated from the NET,
then, if you don't want any updates. Don't get lazy like I did &
ultimately keep a copy of your taxes on the hard drive! OK, bye.


--
Thanks or Good Luck,
There may be humor in this post, and,
Naturally, you will not sue,
should things get worse after this,
PCR

"Bill in Co." wrote in message
...
| I didn't say it with disrespect, but just as a cautionary measure.
And I
| think we are all entitled to have our own opinions.
|
| I don't think there is one "right" answer for everyone in all
situations -
| that's all.
|
| PCR wrote:
| Much as I hate to come to his defense, I suspect, if Terhune were
| blindly doing anything, he'd 'a' fallen into an earthquake by now!
|
| --
| Thanks or Good Luck,
| There may be humor in this post, and,
| Naturally, you will not sue,
| should things get worse after this,
| PCR
|
| "Bill in Co." wrote in message
| ...
| To warn people of the possible pitfalls of just blinding
subscribing to
| the
| "I need to get an update!" mantra.
|
| Gary S. Terhune wrote:
| So, your purpose in participating in this thread is......?
|
| --
| Gary S. Terhune
| MS MVP Shell/User
| http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
| http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
|
| "Bill in Co." wrote in message
| ...
| I'm computer savvy enough to know I'm done with those updates.
(YMMV).
| I've learned my lessons the hard way. That's my story, and I'm
| stickin
| to it - well, at least for the most part, anyway!
|
| Gary S. Terhune wrote:
| I didn't mean that to sound as harsh as it looks. I fully
understand
| why
| people can't or don't want to repro the issue and/or waste more
time
| on
| the problem, particularly those who aren't familiar with the
joys of
| deliberately hacking their own systems, eg. Only, it would
certainly
| help if those who have experienced the problem could give more
| feedback
| to the people who are now in charge of fixing it. Particularly
those
| folks who are especially computer savvy.
|
| --
| Gary S. Terhune
| MS MVP Shell/User
| http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
| http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
|
| "glee" wrote in message
| ...
| Unfortunately, the machines I saw the problems on were at work,
the
| update was removed right away, and I can't put it back on to
test, as
| it
| is a work computer and I cannot "test" on those.
|
| I have not been able to repro the problem on another machine
| yet....maybe
| this weekend I can try on some old machines here at home.
| --
| Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
| http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
|
| "Gary S. Terhune" wrote in message
| ...
| Just read the Win98.Gen_Discussion group, or the
WindowsME.General
| group, and you'll see several examples of KB891711 causing
BSODs.
| Believe me, there *is* a problem, and MS *is* working on a
solution.
| The
| biggest problem we have, now, is most people who are having
trouble
| with
| KB891711 don't seem to be willing to perform some rather
simple
| tests
| and return the results.
|
| --
| Gary S. Terhune
| MS MVP Shell/User
| http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
| http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
|
| snipped for some brevity
|
|

Well, that's not really true, Bill. It works for you, but may or may not work for
others. On some systems it may cause problems or strange behaviours. That's a long
way from "effectively resolved for all practical purposes"
--
Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm


"Bill in Co." wrote in message
...
But the issue has been effectively resolved, for all "practical purposes",
by swapping those two DLL files (IMO). Works GREAT over here!

Rick Chauvin wrote:
cquirke (MVP Windows shell/user) wrote:

More on that, please? Which two .DLL files?

cquirke, if you can find a way to solve this problem without having to
swap
to the old 5.5 dlls and what that means, you will be W9x's official grand
hero! vbg

The problem is real and is a royal p.i.t.a ..I get around it by holding
the
Shift key when I want to delete anything out of the ordinary - and that
seems
to keep me out of the problem, but I would really like to get this fixed
correctly once and for all !

I've seen the work you did with the TS-BATS setup you made for parallel
installs and what that represented in know-how for you to do that, and
other
things, and so I'm complementing you forward to see if you can resolves
this
issue for us too.

Rick

Well, that's not really true, Bill. It works for you, but may or may not work for
others. On some systems it may cause problems or strange behaviours. That's a long
way from "effectively resolved for all practical purposes"
--
Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm


"Bill in Co." wrote in message
...
But the issue has been effectively resolved, for all "practical purposes",
by swapping those two DLL files (IMO). Works GREAT over here!

Rick Chauvin wrote:
cquirke (MVP Windows shell/user) wrote:

More on that, please? Which two .DLL files?

cquirke, if you can find a way to solve this problem without having to
swap
to the old 5.5 dlls and what that means, you will be W9x's official grand
hero! vbg

The problem is real and is a royal p.i.t.a ..I get around it by holding
the
Shift key when I want to delete anything out of the ordinary - and that
seems
to keep me out of the problem, but I would really like to get this fixed
correctly once and for all !

I've seen the work you did with the TS-BATS setup you made for parallel
installs and what that represented in know-how for you to do that, and
other
things, and so I'm complementing you forward to see if you can resolves
this
issue for us too.

Rick

For the few that have reported in here on this issue, it has seemed to work
for them too.

glee wrote:
Well, that's not really true, Bill. It works for you, but may or may not
work for others. On some systems it may cause problems or strange
behaviours. That's a long way from "effectively resolved for all
practical
purposes" --

Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm


"Bill in Co." wrote in message
...
But the issue has been effectively resolved, for all "practical
purposes",
by swapping those two DLL files (IMO). Works GREAT over here!

Rick Chauvin wrote:
cquirke (MVP Windows shell/user) wrote:

More on that, please? Which two .DLL files?

cquirke, if you can find a way to solve this problem without having to
swap
to the old 5.5 dlls and what that means, you will be W9x's official
grand
hero! vbg

The problem is real and is a royal p.i.t.a ..I get around it by
holding
the
Shift key when I want to delete anything out of the ordinary - and that
seems
to keep me out of the problem, but I would really like to get this fixed
correctly once and for all !

I've seen the work you did with the TS-BATS setup you made for parallel
installs and what that represented in know-how for you to do that, and
other
things, and so I'm complementing you forward to see if you can resolves
this
issue for us too.

Rick