Can I boot back and forth between a Master and slave hard drive withwindows 98SE?

On Jan 26, 9:37*pm, DJW wrote:
I have a computer with a partitioned hard drive C and D with windows
98SE on it that is jumped as a master. I added another hard drive that
I ran FDISK and FORMAT which became E jumped as a slave.
I decided to see if I could get windows 98SE on both so I disconnected
the master hard drive and jumped the slave to be the master and put it
on the end of the ribbon cable. I then re-ran FDISK and FORMAT and
then installed another windows 98SE on it. That drive naturally was C
drive.
I then disconnected it and reconnected the original master to the end
of the ribbon cable. I then removed the jumpers from the other hard
drive that made it a slave again and then connected it to the middle
of the ribbon cable.
To my surprise I found that it became D drive and the master
partitioned into two parts became C and E drive.
Question one is why did the master not keep C and D as the letters and
the slave stay at E instead of becoming D.
But what I wanted to be able to do is boot from either hard drive. I
thought if I went into the BIOS changed the boot order that would do
it. But no matter which letter C, D or E I put first it still boots to
the original C partition.
Question number two is am I doing something wrong? Should I not be
able to boot to either drive?

There is a lot of information you need to learn before you can boot
what ever partition you want to in 9x, but using a boot manger program
it can be done. First question's answer is that MS-DOS is set up to
do exactly what you found out, so you have to compensate or forget
about doing it that way. Other rules to follow for booting a simple
BIOS drive swap setup are that each partition that takes up C:
position needs to have it's partition bit set to 'active' (bootable)
state. MS-DOS Fdisk will ONLY set C: to be active, you'll need 3rd
party tools to do it for other partitions like aefdisk. That done it,
should be possible to do a BIOS drive swap boot without the boot
manager program, but you'll learn a lot from reading the programs help
files.
http://btmgr.sourceforge.net

drives are jumpered not jumped and it doesn't matter where in the
cable they are placed - that trick belongs only to floppy drives with
the twist in the cable. The reason NT machines can do it (win2k, XP,
etc.) is because they all use a built in boot manager program that
lets them easily do that. 9x is lacking in that regard, so use a 3rd
party tool and do it too.

To make a partition bootable it has to have it's partition bit set to
active, it then needs io.sys and msdos.sys written to it and
attributed as read only, hidden, and system. It then needs
command.com written to it and then it needs fdisk /mbr done to it
which takes all those aspects into account and links the boot
structure such that the partition can then boot. Without fdisk /mbr
done to it, it won't work. aefdisk /mbr works for other partitions
other than C: which allows for ease in setting up other partitions to
boot properly. Floppies only need io.sys, msdos.sys and command.com
to be written in that order to them (pre DOS 7) and they will boot,
hard drives then need the extra step of fdisk /mbr process done to
them in order to link it all together and allow it to boot. Partition
magic, other partition tools, and boot manager programs are all going
to do this for you and often transparently but the result is the same.

Dos versions of 7.00 and higher (win95) don't require any order for
io.sys or msdos.sys to be written - those slots are reserved in the
directory for files of those names. Earlier DOSes didn't do that and
you had to write those files first or you couldn't boot that floppy
(or hard drive) no matter what. io.sys had to be first for those and
then msdos.sys. Command.com could then be added whenever IIRC. File
attributes had to be read only, system, and hidden for the two .sys
files - ALWAYS. Windows will crash if you forget to do this. It will
also auto recover and rewrite the files often with unexpected results,
I can remember having to reinstall Windows a couple of times just for
this reason, not fun when you had other plans - be careful it can
happen to you too.

Best advice I can give is to experiment on spare drives first, swap
out your main working drive for the 'fiddling around with' drive and
have fun. Don't take a chance with your main Windows installation
drive until you are real good at this.

MyNews wrote:

Not True!

What isn't true?

I Have Win98 on C:, D:, E, and one F: And that PC Windows 2000 is on
D: Now how i do that!

You put them there. So what?

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

On Jan 29, 6:47*am, "dadiOH" wrote:
MyNews wrote:
Not True!

What isn't true?

I Have Win98 on C:, D:, E, and one F: And that PC Windows 2000 is on
D: Now how i do that!

You put them there. *So what?

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
...a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it athttp://mysite.verizon.net/xico

About the active drive part of this. Can only one partition be active
at a time? Is it something made and set by FDISK and is always on the
drive? Also both hard drives are primary partitions because each was
wiped and then setup when they were the only drive attached to the
computer as C. Remember the second hard drive I would like to
sometimes boot from did not have a copy of windows copied from the
other hard drive to t. but rather was the only drive attached and
jumped as master at the time I ran FDISk and FORMAT. Then I did a
clean install of Windows 98SE onto the second hard drive.

And would it matter if the windows install used the same or a
different key code number put into it, for lack of a better word
registration during the install that insures that it is a legal copy
of the installer.

The partition managers spoken above of to let the boot order change
how do you use them. Are they on each drive or one that you run after
one of the drives boots that change things so the next restart (boot)
it then switches the boot order so to speak. I think I understand
above that one way or maybe the only way is that it forces the drives
to change letters and that C will always be booting even though it may
not be the same C before a re-boot.

The Mac has always had a thing in the OS called STARTUP DISK that
shows you all bootable partitions (volumes) and lets you select the
one to boot from at the next time the computer boots. Macs have this
option besides holding down key combinations at startup.

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 11:13:48 -0600, DJW wrote

About the active drive part of this. Can only one partition be active
at a time?

True But the right Boot Software will alternate active drive for you!

Is it something made and set by FDISK and is always on the
drive? Also both hard drives are primary partitions because each was
wiped and then setup when they were the only drive attached to the
computer as C. Remember the second hard drive I would like to
sometimes boot from did not have a copy of windows copied from the
other hard drive to t. but rather was the only drive attached and
jumped as master at the time I ran FDISk and FORMAT. Then I did a
clean install of Windows 98SE onto the second hard drive.
That good,,

Jumped one hard drive as master, second hard drive jumped as Slave!
But we need to know is it a WD, Samsung, or Seagate!
May have to set the jumper to a Cable Select on some hard drives!


You can boot operating systems installed in primary
and extended partitions on any available hard disk.
With the Right Software.

Now "Sunny" can give you a link to a Software Name "Partition Magic"
That will do that for you!
The one i will give is name "GAG"


And would it matter if the windows install used the same or a
different key code number put into it, for lack of a better word
registration during the install that insures that it is a legal copy
of the installer.

No i do not matter!


The partition managers spoken above of to let the boot order change
how do you use them. Are they on each drive or one that you run after
one of the drives boots that change things so the next restart (boot)
it then switches the boot order so to speak. I think I understand
above that one way or maybe the only way is that it forces the drives
to change letters and that C will always be booting even though it may
not be the same C before a re-boot.

The Mac has always had a thing in the OS called STARTUP DISK that
shows you all bootable partitions (volumes) and lets you select the
one to boot from at the next time the computer boots. Macs have this
option besides holding down key combinations at startup.

"Partition Magic" or "GAG" will do just that! 8-)
"Sunny" will help you with "Partition Magic"
I will with "Gag",

Look Here For GAG
http://gag.sourceforge.net/


--
http://mynews.ath.cx/thread.php?grou...wsxp.genera l


Using Opera's revolutionary email client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

DJW wrote:

About the active drive part of this. Can only one partition be active
at a time? Is it something made and set by FDISK and is always on the
drive?

Only one partition on a *physical* drive. Each physical drive can have an
active primary partition.

Don't recall about FDISK as I haven't used it in years, been using an old
version of Paragon's Hard Drive Manager.
http://www.paragon-software.com/home/hdm-personal/

They have a number of free programs including Partition Manager. They have
a fuller version for $9.95 which is most likely worth the money. I've never
used either but what I *do* use is great.
http://www.paragon-software.com/free/pm.html
____________________

Also both hard drives are primary partitions because each was
wiped and then setup when they were the only drive attached to the
computer as C. Remember the second hard drive I would like to
sometimes boot from did not have a copy of windows copied from the
other hard drive to t. but rather was the only drive attached and
jumped as master at the time I ran FDISk and FORMAT. Then I did a
clean install of Windows 98SE onto the second hard drive.

If you want to copy your original HD to it you can. With Win98 I always
used Karen's Replicator v 1.8.10. Duck soup to use. I imagine Paragon
stuff would be as good but maybe not as simple to use.

As I said, I used an old version of Karen's. If you want it, it is
available here...
http://www.clopotel.ro/utile/downloa...r_1810-32.html
________________________

And would it matter if the windows install used the same or a
different key code number put into it, for lack of a better word
registration during the install that insures that it is a legal copy
of the installer.

I have no idea as my installs were from the same Win98 disc. I rather doubt
it would make a difference, MS didn't get real testy about that stuff until
XP came along.
___________________

The partition managers spoken above of to let the boot order change
how do you use them.

I imagine that would depend upon the particular boot manager. I tried only
one when I was messing with Linux. Don't recall which - GAG maybe? - but
absolutely *hated* it. I hated it because it rewrote the MBR and it was a
mess to fix when I dumped the boot manager.
____________________

Are they on each drive or one that you run after
one of the drives boots that change things so the next restart (boot)
it then switches the boot order so to speak.

The one I used presented a boot menu for you to select which OS to boot. As
I said, it modified the MBR so it only needed to be on the "normal" C:
drive.
______________________

I think I understand
above that one way or maybe the only way is that it forces the drives
to change letters and that C will always be booting even though it may
not be the same C before a re-boot.

The requirement for the boot drive to be C: is a requirement of Window, not
a boot manager (AFAIK). No idea how boot managers handle the drive letters
displayed to you by Windows Explorer. Regardless of what you eventually do,
I urge you again to give lables to your drives to help you keep tthem
straight in your mind (by disregarding the letters). To label them...

Open Win Explorer
Right click a drive
Select "Properties"
Type in a name
_______________________

I don't recall if you said why you want the ability to boot from either of
two drives. If it is in case the main Win98 gets screwed up, then I still
think the easiest thing to do is just open the case and swap the IDE cables
between drives. If you back up your main drive with some frequency you can
then boot to the backup drive, use Karen's or whatever to copy it to the
messed up drive, then shut down, switch the IDE cable back and boot to your
normal and now fixed C: drive.


--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

On Jan 29, 2:18*pm, "dadiOH" wrote:
DJW wrote:
About the active drive part of this. Can only one partition be active
at a time? Is it something made and set by FDISK and is always on the
drive?

Only one partition on a *physical* drive. *Each physical drive can have an
active primary partition.

Don't recall about FDISK as I haven't used it in years, been using an old
version of Paragon's Hard Drive Manager.http://www.paragon-software.com/home/hdm-personal/

They have a number of free programs including Partition Manager. *They have
a fuller version for $9.95 which is most likely worth the money. *I've never
used either but what I *do* use is great.http://www.paragon-software.com/free/pm.html
____________________

Also both hard drives are primary partitions because each was
wiped and then setup when they were the only drive attached to the
computer as C. *Remember the second hard drive I would like to
sometimes boot from did not have a copy of windows copied from the
other hard drive to t. but rather was the only drive attached and
jumped as master at the time I ran FDISk and FORMAT. Then I did a
clean install of Windows 98SE onto the second hard drive.

If you want to copy your original HD to it you can. *With Win98 I always
used Karen's Replicator v 1.8.10. *Duck soup to use. *I imagine Paragon
stuff would be as good but maybe not as simple to use.

As I said, I used an old version of Karen's. *If you want it, it is
available here...http://www.clopotel.ro/utile/downloa...eplicator_1810...
________________________

And would it matter if the windows install used the same or a
different key code number put into it, for lack of a better word
registration during the install that insures that it is a legal copy
of the installer.

I have no idea as my installs were from the same Win98 disc. *I rather doubt
it would make a difference, MS didn't get real testy about that stuff until
XP came along.
___________________

The partition managers spoken above of to let the boot order change
how do you use them.

I imagine that would depend upon the particular boot manager. *I tried only
one when I was messing with Linux. *Don't recall which - GAG maybe? - but
absolutely *hated* it. *I hated it because it rewrote the MBR and it was a
mess to fix when I dumped the boot manager.
____________________

Are they on each drive or one that you run after
one of the drives boots that change things so the next restart (boot)
it then switches the boot order so to speak.

The one I used presented a boot menu for you to select which OS to boot. *As
I said, it modified the MBR so it only needed to be on the "normal" C:
drive.
______________________

I think I understand
above that one way or maybe the only way is that it forces the drives
to change letters and that C will always be booting even though it may
not be the same C before a re-boot.

The requirement for the boot drive to be C: is a requirement of Window, not
a boot manager (AFAIK). *No idea how boot managers handle the drive letters
displayed to you by Windows Explorer. *Regardless of what you eventually do,
I urge you again to give lables to your drives to help you keep tthem
straight in your mind (by disregarding the letters). *To label them...

Open Win Explorer
* * Right click a drive
* * * * Select "Properties"
* * * * * * Type in a name
_______________________

I don't recall if you said why you want the ability to boot from either of
two drives. *If it is in case the main Win98 gets screwed up, then I still
think the easiest thing to do is just open the case and swap the IDE cables
between drives. *If you back up your main drive with some frequency you can
then boot to the backup drive, use Karen's or whatever to copy it to the
messed up drive, then shut down, switch the IDE cable back and boot to your
normal and now fixed C: drive.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
...a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it athttp://mysite.verizon.net/xico

The motherboard is an ABIT B6 with a 440BX chipset and installed is a
Pentium 3 mnx 500Mhz.

The 2 partitioned hard drive jumped as master with two jumpers is an
IBM model DJNA-37135 E1822115 HG is a 13.5 GB. I think Hitachi
actually manufactured it for IBM. The hard drive jumped as a slave (no
jumpers install actually) is a Maxtor 6.5 GB model 9065ou2 both are on
the IDE slot 3 that is capable of ATA/66 which both drives are. IDE
slot 1 is used by two CD-ROM drives and slots 2 and 4 are not in use.
One is a CD-RW burner.

The reason I wanted to be able with not a lot of hassle two bootable
hard drives is if the master’s herd drives OS get corrupted or I screw
it up by accident and it does not boot. I could use the OS on the
slave to recover any files not backed up yet to a flash drive or burn
them to a CD before I try to fix the problem or wipe all clean and
start over. That is one plus with a MAC it will automatically just
move to the next bootable volume in an IDE or SCSI chain if for some
reason the OS set to boot from cannot. In most cases you get a
question mark on the screen for a bit and then the computer just moves
on and looks for a boot able OS for that model.

Not sure about what it will do and how to fix the master boot record.
If I decide and it is looking like I will to give up all this screwing
around trying to find an easy way to change the OS to boot from. Again
thought all I would have to do is go into the BIOS at startup and
change the boot order. And I want to use the hard drive non-jumped as
a slave to hold files and maybe some apps but no windows 98SE. What
type of partition should I make it after I wipe it clean? Should I
create it as a primary DOS partition or an extended DOS partition?
Also as long as I am asking about it what is a logical DOS drive
within an extended DOS partition?????

I think I will just temporarily put in and jump as a master an old not
in use Seagate 4GB hard drive and put windows 98SE on it and then
remove it and leave it handy to install back in if I have problems.
And will jump the two partitioned master IBM drive to slave if I need
to get stuff off of it in case of a problem with it.