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#1
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New HDD, has corrupted Data - AGAIN
Ok, As most of you know, I had a partition go bad on one of my drives
and I lost much of the data on it, because I did not have a current backup. I got rid of that hard drive, even after a re-format showed it to be usable and not have bad sectors. This is an old IBM brand computer from about 2001. which originally came with Windows 2000. I've upgraded this machine many times and have used it for years. I do have Win2000 dual bootable on it, but 95% of the time I boot and use Win98se. (I have this crossposted to the XP group because of the lack of activity on the Win98 group). Anyhow, after that partition got damaged, I unplugged that second hard drive (Slave drive) and just used the first drive (bootable one). The first drive is a 120gb with four partitions. The second drive was also a 120gb with three partitions. The partition that went bad, was the G: partition (first partition on second HDD). I have not had any problems with the first HDD at all. After removing that defective second HDD, I put it aside hoping to recover data from it, and I plugged a 160gb HDD into the second IDE connector and partitioned it. It did not take long for that second drive to give me error messsages showing data corruption. I did not have much on that drive, so I just copied it to space on the first HDD. I did however, suspect that was because I know that Win98 does not allow drives larger than 120gb (actually 132gb). I bought another 120gb drive, and just recently installed it. I had not yet put my original data back on it, nor my rebuilt data from G: (which I all have on en external USB drive). This new drive was partitioned into three partitions again. (G: H: I. The G: pattition was still empty. The H: partition I was using for downloading, and contained about 25 downloads, mostly just small .JPG files and a few .PDF files. The I: partition contained a copy of my Agent newsreader which I copied there, as a backup, while I was changing some of Agent's settings. Yesterday I was defragging the first drive's partitions, when I decided to defrag the H: partition, since I had moved around some of the downloaded files. DEFRAG told me this partition had errors and I needed to run Scandisk. Scandisk reported crosslinked files between the DOWNLOAD folder and the RECYCLED folder. (Note, I DO NOT use the Recycled folder, I have it set to immediately delete files. I ran NORTON DISK DOCTOR (rather than Scandisk) to fix this, and it did fix it, but then said that the RECYCLED folder existed but had no space on the HDD. I could not delete the Recycled folder. Since I had already copied all my downloads to another place (as a backup), I just reformatted that H: partition. For the heck of it, I ran DEFRAG on the I: partition (which only contained a backup of my AGENT folder. -Once again, I got a notice to run Scandisk, which showed duplicates of ALL these files in the RECYCLED folder. And said it contained crosslinked files. Since I did not need that backup of Agent anymore, I just reformatted that partition too. Why is this second HDD getting all corrupted? This is a new drive, and I also replaced the IDE cable with a new one (with 80 wires, rather than the old one that had 40 wires). I'm starting to wonder if the motherboard itself is failing (or at least the built in IDE board portion of it). I do have the drive jumpers set properly, to MASTER on the first HDD and to SLAVE on the second drive. I have run two HDDs on this computer for years with no problems. Now it seems I can not run a second SLAVE drive. Any ideas what might be causing this? |
#2
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New HDD, has corrupted Data - AGAIN
Flaky cable ? Replace.
Flaky connector on the controller ? Switch to a different port. Noisy power supply ? Replace. Have another drive port ? Then switch. Overheating ? Fan not getting air over this drive ? Bad Karma ? |
#3
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New HDD, has corrupted Data - AGAIN
On Sat, 16 Dec 2017 12:50:51 -0800, FreeMan wrote:
Flaky cable ? Replace. I just did... Flaky connector on the controller ? Switch to a different port. If this was the case, I dont think the first drive would work either. Noisy power supply ? Replace. ????? Have another drive port ? Then switch. That is where the CD drive is plugged in. Overheating ? Fan not getting air over this drive ? Drive is not even in the case, it's outside of it Bad Karma ? I dont believe in this sort of thing. One thing I did notice. The jumper on the First drive is set to CS (cable select), not to Master (Master uses NO jumper). I'm wondering if the second drive should also be set to CS, instead of SLAVE. Or maybe I should use the actual Master and Slave jumpers??? I never understood how that CS works, or why it's even an option. Older drives never had that setting. Maybe it's just anoither way to **** things up... It kind of seems senseless anyhow. I know the second drive comes first on the cable, but the plug itself is the same wiring. How the hell can the computer KNOW which drive is which. The only difference is about 5" more length to the wires. |
#4
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New HDD, has corrupted Data - AGAIN
On Saturday, December 16, 2017 at 12:26:52 PM UTC-7, wrote:
Ok, As most of you know, I had a partition go bad on one of my drives and I lost much of the data on it, because I did not have a current backup. I got rid of that hard drive, even after a re-format showed it to be usable and not have bad sectors. This is an old IBM brand computer from about 2001. which originally came with Windows 2000. I've upgraded this machine many times and have used it for years. I do have Win2000 dual bootable on it, but 95% of the time I boot and use Win98se. (I have this crossposted to the XP group because of the lack of activity on the Win98 group). Anyhow, after that partition got damaged, I unplugged that second hard drive (Slave drive) and just used the first drive (bootable one). The first drive is a 120gb with four partitions. The second drive was also a 120gb with three partitions. The partition that went bad, was the G: partition (first partition on second HDD). I have not had any problems with the first HDD at all. After removing that defective second HDD, I put it aside hoping to recover data from it, and I plugged a 160gb HDD into the second IDE connector and partitioned it. It did not take long for that second drive to give me error messsages showing data corruption. I did not have much on that drive, so I just copied it to space on the first HDD. I did however, suspect that was because I know that Win98 does not allow drives larger than 120gb (actually 132gb). I bought another 120gb drive, and just recently installed it. I had not yet put my original data back on it, nor my rebuilt data from G: (which I all have on en external USB drive). This new drive was partitioned into three partitions again. (G: H: I. The G: pattition was still empty. The H: partition I was using for downloading, and contained about 25 downloads, mostly just small .JPG files and a few .PDF files. The I: partition contained a copy of my Agent newsreader which I copied there, as a backup, while I was changing some of Agent's settings. Yesterday I was defragging the first drive's partitions, when I decided to defrag the H: partition, since I had moved around some of the downloaded files. DEFRAG told me this partition had errors and I needed to run Scandisk. Scandisk reported crosslinked files between the DOWNLOAD folder and the RECYCLED folder. (Note, I DO NOT use the Recycled folder, I have it set to immediately delete files. I ran NORTON DISK DOCTOR (rather than Scandisk) to fix this, and it did fix it, but then said that the RECYCLED folder existed but had no space on the HDD. I could not delete the Recycled folder. Since I had already copied all my downloads to another place (as a backup), I just reformatted that H: partition. For the heck of it, I ran DEFRAG on the I: partition (which only contained a backup of my AGENT folder. -Once again, I got a notice to run Scandisk, which showed duplicates of ALL these files in the RECYCLED folder. And said it contained crosslinked files. Since I did not need that backup of Agent anymore, I just reformatted that partition too. Why is this second HDD getting all corrupted? This is a new drive, and I also replaced the IDE cable with a new one (with 80 wires, rather than the old one that had 40 wires). I'm starting to wonder if the motherboard itself is failing (or at least the built in IDE board portion of it). I do have the drive jumpers set properly, to MASTER on the first HDD and to SLAVE on the second drive. I have run two HDDs on this computer for years with no problems. Now it seems I can not run a second SLAVE drive. Any ideas what might be causing this? What is the date on your C:/IO.SYS file? There was an update released to fix bad error message transfer from hard drives into DOS and it fixes some 48 bit LBA issues too. 2001 is patched date.. https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/...ardware-errors R. Loew also has more patches, pay for, demo and free concerning the 48bit LBA issue, up to 145 GB is free in one demo offering. http://rloew.x10host.com/ PATCHPAR is free and concerns partition corruption particularly. I use several here ((2)500Gb hard drives), dual boot XP - 98se, 2GB ram, they all work, he is a genius. 3.09 Ghz Pentium 4 Hyper threading 98se installation time is 15 minutes flat to a working desktop. Boot up time is a hoot, but unfortunately I've forgotten the exact seconds needed to get to a working desktop there. Cable Select jumper does work but only with 80 pin cables and a controller designed for that system. Both drives are set to CS and master is the end drive while slave is the one in the middle. Mix and match jumper method you are using may give the results you are complaining about. Just my guess there, mine here would not play right until I set both drives for CS and let the controller figure it out all by it's lonesome. I certainly would look into and catalog links for up to 2TB storage use with win98 despite what any outdated MS page says about FAT32 - they don't support it and won't be going back to correct a single word archived. Cable Select secret is that one of the extra 40 'guard' ground wires is actually a drive select signal. Long gone are the days where this would be the first sentence in 'welcome to Cable Select' intro. WE are not qualified you see. |
#5
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New HDD, has corrupted Data - AGAIN
wrote:
Ok, As most of you know, I had a partition go bad on one of my drives and I lost much of the data on it, because I did not have a current backup. I got rid of that hard drive, even after a re-format showed it to be usable and not have bad sectors. This is an old IBM brand computer from about 2001. which originally came with Windows 2000. I've upgraded this machine many times and have used it for years. I do have Win2000 dual bootable on it, but 95% of the time I boot and use Win98se. (I have this crossposted to the XP group because of the lack of activity on the Win98 group). Anyhow, after that partition got damaged, I unplugged that second hard drive (Slave drive) and just used the first drive (bootable one). The first drive is a 120gb with four partitions. The second drive was also a 120gb with three partitions. The partition that went bad, was the G: partition (first partition on second HDD). I have not had any problems with the first HDD at all. After removing that defective second HDD, I put it aside hoping to recover data from it, and I plugged a 160gb HDD into the second IDE connector and partitioned it. It did not take long for that second drive to give me error messsages showing data corruption. I did not have much on that drive, so I just copied it to space on the first HDD. I did however, suspect that was because I know that Win98 does not allow drives larger than 120gb (actually 132gb). I bought another 120gb drive, and just recently installed it. I had not yet put my original data back on it, nor my rebuilt data from G: (which I all have on en external USB drive). This new drive was partitioned into three partitions again. (G: H: I. The G: pattition was still empty. The H: partition I was using for downloading, and contained about 25 downloads, mostly just small .JPG files and a few .PDF files. The I: partition contained a copy of my Agent newsreader which I copied there, as a backup, while I was changing some of Agent's settings. Yesterday I was defragging the first drive's partitions, when I decided to defrag the H: partition, since I had moved around some of the downloaded files. DEFRAG told me this partition had errors and I needed to run Scandisk. Scandisk reported crosslinked files between the DOWNLOAD folder and the RECYCLED folder. (Note, I DO NOT use the Recycled folder, I have it set to immediately delete files. I ran NORTON DISK DOCTOR (rather than Scandisk) to fix this, and it did fix it, but then said that the RECYCLED folder existed but had no space on the HDD. I could not delete the Recycled folder. Since I had already copied all my downloads to another place (as a backup), I just reformatted that H: partition. For the heck of it, I ran DEFRAG on the I: partition (which only contained a backup of my AGENT folder. -Once again, I got a notice to run Scandisk, which showed duplicates of ALL these files in the RECYCLED folder. And said it contained crosslinked files. Since I did not need that backup of Agent anymore, I just reformatted that partition too. Why is this second HDD getting all corrupted? This is a new drive, and I also replaced the IDE cable with a new one (with 80 wires, rather than the old one that had 40 wires). I'm starting to wonder if the motherboard itself is failing (or at least the built in IDE board portion of it). I do have the drive jumpers set properly, to MASTER on the first HDD and to SLAVE on the second drive. I have run two HDDs on this computer for years with no problems. Now it seems I can not run a second SLAVE drive. Any ideas what might be causing this? When you got the new 120GB drive (the one with G,H,I on it), did you clean if off after connecting it ? At least on WinXP, you have "diskpart" command. Which runs from an Administrator group account. You can select a disk, then issue a command of "clean all", which overwrites every sector. A second way to clean a new disk, is to use "dd". http://www.chrysocome.net/dd dd --list # Gives details about your disks, and # hints at the labels to use dd --list 2 list_of_disks.txt # Record in a text file, the details # of your disks. The program writes to # STDERR, which is FID number 2 of a # command line program. (200KB or so) http://www.chrysocome.net/downloads/dd-0.6beta3.zip Once you have the size information for the device, you craft a command for it. Let's take my smallest drive as sample material for this. In Disk Management, my disks go 0,1,2. The third disk is 2, and the identifier here is also "2". I confirm, by comparing the sizes of disks I see in disk management, with the disk numbers and sizes here, that I'm absolutely sure about what identifier to use for the command. If you make a mistake, you can do a lot of damage with "dd.exe". It doesn't ask you to confirm anything, it doesn't warn you in any way about what you're going to be doing. \\?\Device\Harddisk2\Partition0 --- Partition 0 is the pointer to link to \\?\Device\Harddisk2\DR2 the entire disk. Fixed hard disk media. Block size = 512 size is 500107862016 bytes --- The size of the entire disk \\?\Device\Harddisk2\Partition1 link to \\?\Device\HarddiskVolume1 Fixed hard disk media. Block size = 512 size is 20974431744 bytes 19.53GB partition \\?\Device\Harddisk2\Partition2 link to \\?\Device\HarddiskVolume2 Fixed hard disk media. Block size = 512 size is 14435366400 bytes 13.44GB partition \\?\Device\Harddisk2\Partition3 link to \\?\Device\HarddiskVolume3 Fixed hard disk media. Block size = 512 size is 44794874880 bytes 41.72GB partition \\?\Device\Harddisk2\Partition4 link to \\?\Device\HarddiskVolume4 Fixed hard disk media. Block size = 512 size is 419900544000 bytes 391.06GB partition The size of the disk, can be factored by small integers. From memory, I happen to remember a "convenient" size for this disk is 221184 byte commands. 221184 / 512 = 432 sectors (an evenly divisible sector-related size) (256KB is a ballpark target for a size, on an older HDD) (Setting the size to 512 bytes only, makes it slooow.) 500107862016 / 221184 = 2261049 chunks So the number does divide evenly into the size of the disk as well. (I use the Linux program factor.exe to factor the number and figure out what a reasonable size might be.) OK, so now comes the fun part. I want to do two things: 1) Remove any existing data. 2) "Probe" the disk, doing realistic write operations. If there is something wrong with the geometry of the disk, there is an HPA or DCO, there is a disturbance in the force, I want the command to detect something is wrong. In an Administrator command prompt, I can try dd if=/dev/zero of=\\?\Device\Harddisk2\Partition0 bs=221184 Now, normally the command would have "count=2261049" to make the command do a fixed amount of writing. However, we want the command to keep writing, until it runs out of disk drive. If we do it this way dd if=/dev/zero of=\\?\Device\Harddisk2\Partition0 bs=221184 then after a couple hours, the command stops and spits out a couple lines. We hope the two lines are exactly 2261049, and the command has figured this out the hard way, by writing each sector. If the command reports some other number of completed chunks, that means there is an "issue" with the setup. The value of the numbers printed out, will hint at what the issue is. Is it the 137GB disk limit ? Is it a 64GB disk limit ? What limit did we hit ? Or, did the disk pass, and we wrote exactly 2261049 chunks of 221184 bytes each ? Your drive is smaller than mine, and you will have a different set of numbers. You'll have to work out a value for the blocksize. If you need help, just paste the same sort of section that I did, into a post, and I can cook up a command for you. The dd.exe program only has one bug. If you erase USB sticks with the program, the program does not successfully detect the end of a USB key. Thus, you cannot use this sort of "probing" command with a USB stick... dd if=/dev/zero of=\\?\Device\Harddisk2\Partition0 bs=221184 Instead, with a USB stick, you have to write a precise quantity of bytes, using the count field too. dd if=/dev/zero of=\\?\Device\Harddisk2\Partition0 bs=221184 count=2261049 That way, it doesn't do anything disconcerting, like "write past the end" of the USB stick. That kinda scared me, the first time it happened. Anyway, that's a little test case I use occasionally, when surpassing canonical capacity limits on computers. I used to test disk capacity by copying files over and over again, but that gets really old fast. Having a command to use up all the bytes, is a lot simpler. Paul |
#6
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New HDD, has corrupted Data - AGAIN
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#7
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New HDD, has corrupted Data - AGAIN
On Sun, 17 Dec 2017 06:57:37 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote: In message , writes: On Sat, 16 Dec 2017 12:50:51 -0800, FreeMan wrote: [] Noisy power supply ? Replace. ????? I think he meant electrically noisy. Some power supplies don't provide as smooth a 5V and 12V as you might hope - spikes or dips. Can in theory make drives (and anything else) malfunction. _Probably_ not your cause; difficult to confirm without an oscilloscope. (If you have a known good power supply of sufficient capacity, you can always try it.) Have another drive port ? Then switch. That is where the CD drive is plugged in. Overheating ? Fan not getting air over this drive ? Drive is not even in the case, it's outside of it Does it run warm at all? Both drives get slightly warm. That's just normal. I have not mounted a hard drive inside the case for at least 15 years.I put a large very oversized power supply in this case, so the cover wont fit anyhow. I like having the drives where I can easily swap them. The only drives that are mounted in the case are the floppy and CD drives. Bad Karma ? I dont believe in this sort of thing. One thing I did notice. The jumper on the First drive is set to CS (cable select), not to Master (Master uses NO jumper). I'm wondering if the second drive should also be set to CS, instead of SLAVE. Or maybe I should use the actual Master and Slave jumpers??? Have you still got what used to be the other drive (IIRR it was a CD drive that failed) to see how that is jumpered? Anyway, if your first drive is set to CS, and you have a CS cable, then it sounds like the second one should be too. Can you see any setting in the BIOS that indicates which selection method it is using? I've personally never had a machine that used other than master and slave jumpers. Yep, it looks like the old drive was set to SLAVE. However, I just changed the new one to CS and copied a bunch of stuff to it from my first drive. Then I deleted some stuff and copied a whole bunch of small clipart pics to it, and then deleted some of them, and after that I copied a huge ISO file to it, which is almost 1gb in size. After all of that, I defragged that drive with no problem. It appears that it needs to be set to CS. Maybe that was the whole problem. I'll copy more stuff to it and delete other stuff and see if it keeps working properly now. So far, so good! I ma tempted to try the actual Master and Slave settings with the jumpers and see if that works. I dont know if one way is better than the other, or not? Does anyone know which jumper setting is the best? I never understood how that CS works, or why it's even an option. Older drives never had that setting. Maybe it's just anoither way to **** things up... It kind of seems senseless anyhow. I know the second drive comes first on the cable, but the plug itself is the same wiring. How the hell can the computer KNOW which drive is which. The only difference is about 5" more length to the wires. If the cable truly has the same connections on all three connectors, then I can't see how it's selecting either. I know floppy drive cables had a twist in the cable. Yep, floppy cables do have a twist, but not these IDE Hard drive cables. So how that CS works is beyond my comprehension. I do know that for awhile I had the Master drive on the first connector and Slave on the last connector. THAT IS WRONG, but it was that way for a year or more and worked fine. Maybe it dont much matter which cable comes first, but according to several articles, the last connector goes to the first drive (which seems backwards). |
#8
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New HDD, has corrupted Data - AGAIN
On Sat, 16 Dec 2017 22:38:48 -0500, Paul wrote:
When you got the new 120GB drive (the one with G,H,I on it), did you clean if off after connecting it ? No, I just plugged it in, used Partition Magic to partition it, and formatted them (P.M. does the formatting too). At least on WinXP, you have "diskpart" command. Which runs from an Administrator group account. You can select a disk, then issue a command of "clean all", which overwrites every sector. Since this drive is running Win98, I dont think I have any of that stuff. What is the point of cleaning it? It should be blank, and if not, this is not a secret government operation containing all the codes to launch the nukes worldwide.... About the only controversial or secret stuff might be a few pics of cows with their tits showing, and a pic of God smoking some whacky weed.... Besides that, I've probably re-formatted every partition at least 4 times now, because of these problems. If that didn't clean the drives, what will.... |
#10
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New HDD, has corrupted Data - AGAIN
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