891711/MS05-002 "fixed" update: *sigh*

When I originally installed this update on my laptop PC, my computer
experienced problems after the install and would lock up completely while
starting up (after logging in and while the other startup programs were
loading), requiring me to turn it off and back on. So, I booted into Safe
Mode and uninstalled the update.

Unfortunately, the exact same startup problem happens with the "fixed"
update. If I ever feel the urge to drive myself crazy, I'll consider trying
to disable the other startup programs one at a time to try to figure out
which one is the problem; until then, I've disabled the
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\Curr entVersion\RunServices
executable via msconfig and added a shortcut on the desktop to run it
manually. Does anyone know if this would interfere with the effectiveness of
the security update?

- Alan

Yes, it will pretty much completely disable the update if you don't let
it run. The running task *is* the update. On the other hand, do I read
you correctly that you start it manually *after* Windows loads?

If you have the time, could you please try the following t-shooting
steps?

Use MSCONFIG to disable everything in the Startup tab *except* KB891711.
Physically disconnect your internet connection (telephone line or LAN
line, USB cable, whatever, for safety.) Restart. Does the failure still
occur? If so, use Safe Mode to recover. If not, then use MSCONFIG to add
items back in until you find the incompatible item, restarting and
testing after each new addition.

Come to think of it, what kind of internet connection do you have?

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Alan Raskin" wrote in message
...
When I originally installed this update on my laptop PC, my computer
experienced problems after the install and would lock up completely
while
starting up (after logging in and while the other startup programs
were
loading), requiring me to turn it off and back on. So, I booted into
Safe
Mode and uninstalled the update.

Unfortunately, the exact same startup problem happens with the "fixed"
update. If I ever feel the urge to drive myself crazy, I'll consider
trying
to disable the other startup programs one at a time to try to figure
out
which one is the problem; until then, I've disabled the

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\Curr entVersion\RunServices
executable via msconfig and added a shortcut on the desktop to run it
manually. Does anyone know if this would interfere with the
effectiveness of
the security update?

- Alan

Yes, it will pretty much completely disable the update if you don't let
it run. The running task *is* the update. On the other hand, do I read
you correctly that you start it manually *after* Windows loads?

If you have the time, could you please try the following t-shooting
steps?

Use MSCONFIG to disable everything in the Startup tab *except* KB891711.
Physically disconnect your internet connection (telephone line or LAN
line, USB cable, whatever, for safety.) Restart. Does the failure still
occur? If so, use Safe Mode to recover. If not, then use MSCONFIG to add
items back in until you find the incompatible item, restarting and
testing after each new addition.

Come to think of it, what kind of internet connection do you have?

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Alan Raskin" wrote in message
...
When I originally installed this update on my laptop PC, my computer
experienced problems after the install and would lock up completely
while
starting up (after logging in and while the other startup programs
were
loading), requiring me to turn it off and back on. So, I booted into
Safe
Mode and uninstalled the update.

Unfortunately, the exact same startup problem happens with the "fixed"
update. If I ever feel the urge to drive myself crazy, I'll consider
trying
to disable the other startup programs one at a time to try to figure
out
which one is the problem; until then, I've disabled the

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\Curr entVersion\RunServices
executable via msconfig and added a shortcut on the desktop to run it
manually. Does anyone know if this would interfere with the
effectiveness of
the security update?

- Alan

That's right, I use the desktop shortcut to manually start KB891711 once
everything else has finished loading; MSINFO then reports that both the EXE
and the DLL are running.

And I have a dial-up connection.

- Alan

"Gary S. Terhune" wrote in message
...
Yes, it will pretty much completely disable the update if you don't let
it run. The running task *is* the update. On the other hand, do I read
you correctly that you start it manually *after* Windows loads?

If you have the time, could you please try the following t-shooting
steps?

Use MSCONFIG to disable everything in the Startup tab *except* KB891711.
Physically disconnect your internet connection (telephone line or LAN
line, USB cable, whatever, for safety.) Restart. Does the failure still
occur? If so, use Safe Mode to recover. If not, then use MSCONFIG to add
items back in until you find the incompatible item, restarting and
testing after each new addition.

Come to think of it, what kind of internet connection do you have?

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Alan Raskin" wrote in message
...
When I originally installed this update on my laptop PC, my computer
experienced problems after the install and would lock up completely
while
starting up (after logging in and while the other startup programs
were
loading), requiring me to turn it off and back on. So, I booted into
Safe
Mode and uninstalled the update.

Unfortunately, the exact same startup problem happens with the "fixed"
update. If I ever feel the urge to drive myself crazy, I'll consider
trying
to disable the other startup programs one at a time to try to figure
out
which one is the problem; until then, I've disabled the

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\Curr entVersion\RunServices
executable via msconfig and added a shortcut on the desktop to run it
manually. Does anyone know if this would interfere with the
effectiveness of
the security update?

- Alan

That's right, I use the desktop shortcut to manually start KB891711 once
everything else has finished loading; MSINFO then reports that both the EXE
and the DLL are running.

And I have a dial-up connection.

- Alan

"Gary S. Terhune" wrote in message
...
Yes, it will pretty much completely disable the update if you don't let
it run. The running task *is* the update. On the other hand, do I read
you correctly that you start it manually *after* Windows loads?

If you have the time, could you please try the following t-shooting
steps?

Use MSCONFIG to disable everything in the Startup tab *except* KB891711.
Physically disconnect your internet connection (telephone line or LAN
line, USB cable, whatever, for safety.) Restart. Does the failure still
occur? If so, use Safe Mode to recover. If not, then use MSCONFIG to add
items back in until you find the incompatible item, restarting and
testing after each new addition.

Come to think of it, what kind of internet connection do you have?

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Alan Raskin" wrote in message
...
When I originally installed this update on my laptop PC, my computer
experienced problems after the install and would lock up completely
while
starting up (after logging in and while the other startup programs
were
loading), requiring me to turn it off and back on. So, I booted into
Safe
Mode and uninstalled the update.

Unfortunately, the exact same startup problem happens with the "fixed"
update. If I ever feel the urge to drive myself crazy, I'll consider
trying
to disable the other startup programs one at a time to try to figure
out
which one is the problem; until then, I've disabled the

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\Curr entVersion\RunServices
executable via msconfig and added a shortcut on the desktop to run it
manually. Does anyone know if this would interfere with the
effectiveness of
the security update?

- Alan

"Alan Raskin" wrote in message
...
That's right, I use the desktop shortcut to manually start KB891711
once
everything else has finished loading; MSINFO then reports that both
the EXE
and the DLL are running.

Thanks for the clarification.

And I have a dial-up connection.

That probably rules out internet connection problems (thinking of
always-on internet connection issues in that were prominent among some
of the previous version's incompatibilities.) I'd still appreciate it if
you would do the t-shooting I requested. Yours is the first report I've
seen of the new version causing any problems, and I'd like to see if we
can narrow the scope of investigation. I can pass that data on to PSS
contacts, and also ask if your workaround has any drawbacks.

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Alan Raskin" wrote in message
...
That's right, I use the desktop shortcut to manually start KB891711
once
everything else has finished loading; MSINFO then reports that both
the EXE
and the DLL are running.

Thanks for the clarification.

And I have a dial-up connection.

That probably rules out internet connection problems (thinking of
always-on internet connection issues in that were prominent among some
of the previous version's incompatibilities.) I'd still appreciate it if
you would do the t-shooting I requested. Yours is the first report I've
seen of the new version causing any problems, and I'd like to see if we
can narrow the scope of investigation. I can pass that data on to PSS
contacts, and also ask if your workaround has any drawbacks.

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

This sounds similar to a problem that used to occur in Zone Alarm firewall, when it
was started as a Service in the RunServices key. Changing how it loaded used to fix
the problem for Zone Alarm. One would remove the entry to start it from RunServices
in the Registry, and instead run it from a shortcut in the user's StartUp folder,
where it would load later in the boot sequence.

INFO: Run, RunOnce, RunServices, RunServicesOnce and Startup:
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=179365
--
Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
http://www.microsoft.com/communities...t/default.mspx


"Alan Raskin" wrote in message
...
That's right, I use the desktop shortcut to manually start KB891711 once
everything else has finished loading; MSINFO then reports that both the EXE
and the DLL are running.

And I have a dial-up connection.

- Alan

"Gary S. Terhune" wrote in message
...
Yes, it will pretty much completely disable the update if you don't let
it run. The running task *is* the update. On the other hand, do I read
you correctly that you start it manually *after* Windows loads?

If you have the time, could you please try the following t-shooting
steps?

Use MSCONFIG to disable everything in the Startup tab *except* KB891711.
Physically disconnect your internet connection (telephone line or LAN
line, USB cable, whatever, for safety.) Restart. Does the failure still
occur? If so, use Safe Mode to recover. If not, then use MSCONFIG to add
items back in until you find the incompatible item, restarting and
testing after each new addition.

Come to think of it, what kind of internet connection do you have?

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Alan Raskin" wrote in message
...
When I originally installed this update on my laptop PC, my computer
experienced problems after the install and would lock up completely
while
starting up (after logging in and while the other startup programs
were
loading), requiring me to turn it off and back on. So, I booted into
Safe
Mode and uninstalled the update.

Unfortunately, the exact same startup problem happens with the "fixed"
update. If I ever feel the urge to drive myself crazy, I'll consider
trying
to disable the other startup programs one at a time to try to figure
out
which one is the problem; until then, I've disabled the

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\Curr entVersion\RunServices
executable via msconfig and added a shortcut on the desktop to run it
manually. Does anyone know if this would interfere with the
effectiveness of
the security update?

- Alan

This sounds similar to a problem that used to occur in Zone Alarm firewall, when it
was started as a Service in the RunServices key. Changing how it loaded used to fix
the problem for Zone Alarm. One would remove the entry to start it from RunServices
in the Registry, and instead run it from a shortcut in the user's StartUp folder,
where it would load later in the boot sequence.

INFO: Run, RunOnce, RunServices, RunServicesOnce and Startup:
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=179365
--
Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
http://www.microsoft.com/communities...t/default.mspx


"Alan Raskin" wrote in message
...
That's right, I use the desktop shortcut to manually start KB891711 once
everything else has finished loading; MSINFO then reports that both the EXE
and the DLL are running.

And I have a dial-up connection.

- Alan

"Gary S. Terhune" wrote in message
...
Yes, it will pretty much completely disable the update if you don't let
it run. The running task *is* the update. On the other hand, do I read
you correctly that you start it manually *after* Windows loads?

If you have the time, could you please try the following t-shooting
steps?

Use MSCONFIG to disable everything in the Startup tab *except* KB891711.
Physically disconnect your internet connection (telephone line or LAN
line, USB cable, whatever, for safety.) Restart. Does the failure still
occur? If so, use Safe Mode to recover. If not, then use MSCONFIG to add
items back in until you find the incompatible item, restarting and
testing after each new addition.

Come to think of it, what kind of internet connection do you have?

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Alan Raskin" wrote in message
...
When I originally installed this update on my laptop PC, my computer
experienced problems after the install and would lock up completely
while
starting up (after logging in and while the other startup programs
were
loading), requiring me to turn it off and back on. So, I booted into
Safe
Mode and uninstalled the update.

Unfortunately, the exact same startup problem happens with the "fixed"
update. If I ever feel the urge to drive myself crazy, I'll consider
trying
to disable the other startup programs one at a time to try to figure
out
which one is the problem; until then, I've disabled the

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\Curr entVersion\RunServices
executable via msconfig and added a shortcut on the desktop to run it
manually. Does anyone know if this would interfere with the
effectiveness of
the security update?

- Alan

glee wrote:
This sounds similar to a problem that used to occur in Zone Alarm firewall, when it
was started as a Service in the RunServices key. Changing how it loaded used to fix
the problem for Zone Alarm. One would remove the entry to start it from RunServices
in the Registry, and instead run it from a shortcut in the user's StartUp folder,
where it would load later in the boot sequence.

INFO: Run, RunOnce, RunServices, RunServicesOnce and Startup:
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=179365

Disabling all my startup programs and enabling them one at a time
reveals that the culprits a

ZoneAlarm Free 3.7.159 (firewall)
and
Rain ("CPU cooler")

(Both of these are relatively old programs.)

Trying to load ZoneAlarm manually after everything else had finished
loading also caused my system to freeze.

So, I upgraded to ZoneAlarm Free 4.5.594.000 and the problem went away.

- Alan