A Windows 98 & ME forum. Win98banter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » Win98banter forum » Windows 98 » General
Site Map Home Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

HDD upgrade - no boot - 48LBA? KM400-M2



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Old November 2nd 10, 10:24 PM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion
legg
External Usenet User
 
Posts: 187
Default HDD upgrade - no boot - 48LBA? KM400-M2

On Tue, 02 Nov 2010 07:44:42 -0500, philo wrote:

On 10/31/2010 07:01 PM, legg wrote:
On Sun, 31 Oct 2010 16:32:19 -0500, wrote:

On 10/31/2010 02:55 PM, legg wrote:
Transfering W98SE from 80G HD to sole 130Gpartition on 160G HD, in
dual boot (w982ed C;/, W2K SP4 D:\on separate HDD)
When the new 160G HD is relocated to primary master ide, the KM400-M2
stops after recognizing all drives, refuses to boot from any disk,
even the floppy, and after long delay issues a hd fatal error warning.

Have gone through the transfer attempt twice, using different W982ed
sources (original then last back-up) to different but identical 160G
targets (WD1600AAJB - of three purchased for anticipated ternary
backup), with the same results.

Original configuration W982ed on 80G C:\ , W2K SP4 on D: still boots
up normally.

Is this a symptom of 48LBA limitations in the KM400-M2 MB or bios,
even though the partition size selected is lower than 135G?

How do I get around it? No indication of 48LBA being addressed in bios
revs - so assume was never an issue..?..but ECS forums are mute on
this 'old' issue and Intel support (48lbachk.exe) no longer available.

WD is no longer interested in W98 (or W2K) issues. Used WD DLG Ver11.0
for the formating, partitioning and file transfer in both cases -
though in the second instance I manually set the partition size rather
than allowing an automatically-enforced 137G limitation that was
W98-OS-triggered in the first attempt.

RL



No matter how you have the drive partitioned,
some bios's just will not support drives that large.

If there is no bios update
then get a PCI controller


I've just checked the previous ternary set and it seems that a 160GB
drive has been slipped into this group, during the last four years and
has been processed with an ~80GB single partition, without an issue.
It's the same model drive I'm having trouble introducing now, with the
larger partition.

RL




If you have on operating system installed on one drive
then add an add'l drive that is larger than the bios can support...
all you need to do is *disable* that channel in the bios.

The machine should now boot normally and the operating system should see
the drive.
If you are using XP_sp3 or above, the entire 160 gigs should be
available. have a look in disc management


No WXP on this system.

The system will boot the W98 2ed OS, on the new 160G HDD, with single
125/137G partition, in primary master position, provided the primary
slave slot is empty. If there's a slave installed (W2K sp4 alternate
boot OS), then it won't boot from anything, not even a floppy.

RL
  #22  
Old November 3rd 10, 02:05 AM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion
Hot-text
External Usenet User
 
Posts: 1,026
Default HDD upgrade - no boot - 48LBA? KM400-M2

1 All EIDE drives 8.4 GB and larger use 16383 cylinders, 16 heads and 63 SPT
due to interface restrictions.
http://wdc.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/wdc....7%2C295#jumper



"legg" wrote in message
...
Transfering W98SE from 80G HD to sole 130Gpartition on 160G HD, in
dual boot (w982ed C;/, W2K SP4 D:\on separate HDD)
When the new 160G HD is relocated to primary master ide, the KM400-M2
stops after recognizing all drives, refuses to boot from any disk,
even the floppy, and after long delay issues a hd fatal error warning.

Have gone through the transfer attempt twice, using different W982ed
sources (original then last back-up) to different but identical 160G
targets (WD1600AAJB - of three purchased for anticipated ternary
backup), with the same results.

Original configuration W982ed on 80G C:\ , W2K SP4 on D: still boots
up normally.

Is this a symptom of 48LBA limitations in the KM400-M2 MB or bios,
even though the partition size selected is lower than 135G?

How do I get around it? No indication of 48LBA being addressed in bios
revs - so assume was never an issue..?..but ECS forums are mute on
this 'old' issue and Intel support (48lbachk.exe) no longer available.

WD is no longer interested in W98 (or W2K) issues. Used WD DLG Ver11.0
for the formating, partitioning and file transfer in both cases -
though in the second instance I manually set the partition size rather
than allowing an automatically-enforced 137G limitation that was
W98-OS-triggered in the first attempt.

RL


  #23  
Old November 3rd 10, 03:13 AM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion
Bill Blanton[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 96
Default HDD upgrade - no boot - 48LBA? KM400-M2

On 11/2/2010 17:24, legg wrote:
On Tue, 02 Nov 2010 07:44:42 -0500, wrote:

On 10/31/2010 07:01 PM, legg wrote:
On Sun, 31 Oct 2010 16:32:19 -0500, wrote:

On 10/31/2010 02:55 PM, legg wrote:
Transfering W98SE from 80G HD to sole 130Gpartition on 160G HD, in
dual boot (w982ed C;/, W2K SP4 D:\on separate HDD)
When the new 160G HD is relocated to primary master ide, the KM400-M2
stops after recognizing all drives, refuses to boot from any disk,
even the floppy, and after long delay issues a hd fatal error warning.

Have gone through the transfer attempt twice, using different W982ed
sources (original then last back-up) to different but identical 160G
targets (WD1600AAJB - of three purchased for anticipated ternary
backup), with the same results.

Original configuration W982ed on 80G C:\ , W2K SP4 on D: still boots
up normally.

Is this a symptom of 48LBA limitations in the KM400-M2 MB or bios,
even though the partition size selected is lower than 135G?

How do I get around it? No indication of 48LBA being addressed in bios
revs - so assume was never an issue..?..but ECS forums are mute on
this 'old' issue and Intel support (48lbachk.exe) no longer available.

WD is no longer interested in W98 (or W2K) issues. Used WD DLG Ver11.0
for the formating, partitioning and file transfer in both cases -
though in the second instance I manually set the partition size rather
than allowing an automatically-enforced 137G limitation that was
W98-OS-triggered in the first attempt.

RL



No matter how you have the drive partitioned,
some bios's just will not support drives that large.

If there is no bios update
then get a PCI controller

I've just checked the previous ternary set and it seems that a 160GB
drive has been slipped into this group, during the last four years and
has been processed with an ~80GB single partition, without an issue.
It's the same model drive I'm having trouble introducing now, with the
larger partition.

RL




If you have on operating system installed on one drive
then add an add'l drive that is larger than the bios can support...
all you need to do is *disable* that channel in the bios.

The machine should now boot normally and the operating system should see
the drive.
If you are using XP_sp3 or above, the entire 160 gigs should be
available. have a look in disc management


No WXP on this system.

The system will boot the W98 2ed OS, on the new 160G HDD, with single
125/137G partition, in primary master position, provided the primary
slave slot is empty. If there's a slave installed (W2K sp4 alternate
boot OS), then it won't boot from anything, not even a floppy.


Does the BIOS see the primary drive if the slave is connected, or is it
a soft boot failure?

  #24  
Old November 3rd 10, 01:16 PM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion
legg
External Usenet User
 
Posts: 187
Default HDD upgrade - no boot - 48LBA? KM400-M2

On Tue, 02 Nov 2010 22:13:10 -0400, Bill Blanton
wrote:

On 11/2/2010 17:24, legg wrote:

snip
If you have on operating system installed on one drive
then add an add'l drive that is larger than the bios can support...
all you need to do is *disable* that channel in the bios.

The machine should now boot normally and the operating system should see
the drive.
If you are using XP_sp3 or above, the entire 160 gigs should be
available. have a look in disc management


No WXP on this system.

The system will boot the W98 2ed OS, on the new 160G HDD, with single
125/137G partition, in primary master position, provided the primary
slave slot is empty. If there's a slave installed (W2K sp4 alternate
boot OS), then it won't boot from anything, not even a floppy.


Does the BIOS see the primary drive if the slave is connected, or is it
a soft boot failure?


All connected drives are listed correctly as the boot process stops.

RL
  #25  
Old November 3rd 10, 01:31 PM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion
Bill Blanton[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 96
Default HDD upgrade - no boot - 48LBA? KM400-M2

On 11/3/2010 08:16, legg wrote:
On Tue, 02 Nov 2010 22:13:10 -0400, Bill Blanton
wrote:

On 11/2/2010 17:24, legg wrote:

snip
If you have on operating system installed on one drive
then add an add'l drive that is larger than the bios can support...
all you need to do is *disable* that channel in the bios.

The machine should now boot normally and the operating system should see
the drive.
If you are using XP_sp3 or above, the entire 160 gigs should be
available. have a look in disc management

No WXP on this system.

The system will boot the W98 2ed OS, on the new 160G HDD, with single
125/137G partition, in primary master position, provided the primary
slave slot is empty. If there's a slave installed (W2K sp4 alternate
boot OS), then it won't boot from anything, not even a floppy.


Does the BIOS see the primary drive if the slave is connected, or is it
a soft boot failure?


All connected drives are listed correctly as the boot process stops.


No error messages? Are you still getting the ~HD fatal error?

In the case of the floppy boot, are you certain that floppy is set to
boot before HD?
  #26  
Old November 3rd 10, 08:46 PM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion
legg
External Usenet User
 
Posts: 187
Default HDD upgrade - no boot - 48LBA? KM400-M2

On Wed, 03 Nov 2010 08:31:59 -0400, Bill Blanton
wrote:

On 11/3/2010 08:16, legg wrote:
On Tue, 02 Nov 2010 22:13:10 -0400, Bill Blanton
wrote:

On 11/2/2010 17:24, legg wrote:

snip
If you have on operating system installed on one drive
then add an add'l drive that is larger than the bios can support...
all you need to do is *disable* that channel in the bios.

The machine should now boot normally and the operating system should see
the drive.
If you are using XP_sp3 or above, the entire 160 gigs should be
available. have a look in disc management

No WXP on this system.

The system will boot the W98 2ed OS, on the new 160G HDD, with single
125/137G partition, in primary master position, provided the primary
slave slot is empty. If there's a slave installed (W2K sp4 alternate
boot OS), then it won't boot from anything, not even a floppy.

Does the BIOS see the primary drive if the slave is connected, or is it
a soft boot failure?


All connected drives are listed correctly as the boot process stops.


No error messages? Are you still getting the ~HD fatal error?


Usually don't wait that long to find out. Takes some time.


In the case of the floppy boot, are you certain that floppy is set to
boot before HD?


Yes, and it does, if boot procedes. I've been using it to clean boot
and try to get some cooperation from one of the W98 attempts.

RL
  #27  
Old November 3rd 10, 11:00 PM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion
J. P. Gilliver (John)
External Usenet User
 
Posts: 1,554
Default HDD upgrade - no boot - 48LBA? KM400-M2

In message , 98 Guy writes:
"J. P. Gilliver (John)" wrote:

There is probably a link configuration on the drive that makes it
look like a 128/137G drive (i. e. you waste the remainder);


Maybe, but there's a simple solution in any case:

Take the drive in question, attach it to a PC and boot the PC with an
MS-DOS floppy disk that has fdisk.exe and format.com on the floppy. If
you're running win-98, it's trivial to create a bootable MS-DOS floppy.

Boot the floppy, run Fdisk, delete all existing partitions and volumes,
re-start the PC and again boot into DOS, again run fdisk, create new
primary partition, but make the size of that partition 128 gb.

Done.

Reboot, again boot the floppy, run format and format the 128 gb
partition.

Regardless what the drive's capacity is, you're using the first 128 gb
of it, which will make it compatible with Windows 98.


_IF_ the BIOS can't handle drives over 128/137, then _whatever_ you do
with partitions won't help.

(This is probably not the problem in this case, as the poster says he's
used a 160G drive - with an 80G partition - on this system.)
[]
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Nothing fixes a thing so intensely in the memory as the wish to forget it.
-Michel de Montaigne, essayist (1533-1592)
  #28  
Old November 4th 10, 02:44 AM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion
glee
External Usenet User
 
Posts: 2,458
Default HDD upgrade - no boot - 48LBA? KM400-M2

"legg" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 2 Nov 2010 02:07:01 -0400, "glee"
wrote:

"legg" wrote in message
. ..

snip
I have the W98 2ed normally in primary master, the W2K SP4 in
primary slave positions. Optical and bulk data on the secondary
IDE.

The 80G drives are WD WD800JB-00JJC0 ca 2006
The new drives are WD WD1600AAJB-00PVA0 ca 2008

As suggested by Mr.Blanton and recently noted to him, the new
drives will boot if the primary slave position is vacant.


I am trying to replace just the one holding the W98 2ed OS, normally
on primary master.

The drives will boot if both jumpers are set to cable select, and
only
if that is the case.

I've never used the cable select jumper location, ever, anywhere,
before. Certainly never had to.
snip


You still haven't said what jumpering you are trying. If the drive
will
boot when the slave position is vacant, you have likely set the jumper
to "Single"....and when you add a slave drive the "Single" jumper
setting is incorrect. Have you changed the jumper setting to "Dual
Master" for the boot drive when adding a slave to the same cable?


As previously mentioned, the successful boot to floppy with both
primary master (new W98 2ED)and primary slave (unaltered W2K SP4)
jumpers set to cable select was not repeatable.

There is no jumper setting on these WD hard drives for 'dual master'.
Label-printed options a
1) cable select
2) slave
3) master w/ slave present
4) single or master

First unsuccessful configuration was pri master - 3 / pri slave - 2.
This was the working configuration previously and still works when old
primary master is re-inserted (as per now) to get a working system to
exercise usenet etc.

The new drive will run in master with an unpopulated slave position.
When the slave position carries the alternate boot OS drive, no boot
is possible.

Western Digital is the only brand that has the "Single" jumper setting
as well as Master, Slave and Cable Select. here are the two drives
you
listed...look at the jumper setting options:
http://wdc.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/wdc....p?p_faqid=2530
http://www.wdc.com/en/products/curre...?Model=wd800jb

I see where you get the 'dual' terminology from, when reviewing your
jumper links. This is a 10-pin header model, and though the
terminology is changed from that printed on the drive itself, the
obvious intended function and jumper orientation for each is not. It's
nice to know that there are benign pins on which to park an unused
jumper, but this is not new information.

What IDE cables are you using? Are they 40-pin, 80-wire IDE cables
with
a grey, a black, and a blue connector? Which connector is attached to
which location? Blue goes to the mobo, black to the primary or single
drive (master), and grey to the secondary (slave).

These are the same high density connectors used previously, in
unchanged locations. They are not stressed regularly, save to check
seating, as drive trays house both of these drives, and the secondary
slave position.

I suppose that, in the end, one of the things I'll have to try is
chucking the tray hardware, but this seems non-intuitive if source
HDDs function in it, when reinserted.

If there are 4 hard drives, put the 2 80GB drives on the same cable,
and
the 2 160GB drives on the other.

If just 2 hard drives are installed and one is 80GB and the other is
160GB, if they do not work together on the same cable, put them each
as
master on a separate cable. Note: set jumpers to Single in this case,
even if you install an optical drive as slave....Single vs. master
only
applies to hard drives with Western Digital drives.


This is (or was up until the 31st) a dual-boot OS with W98 2ed on it's
own drive in pri master location, W2K SP4 in primary slave position,
with optical and occasional bulk storage in the secondary IDE. All I'm
trying to do is relocate the W98 2ed OS to a new drive with a single
suitably-sized (125/137G) partition. This is an action that was
previously successful with the same ~ model WD drive, fitted up as
80G, with no unusual boot issues, in the last ternary back-up drive
set.

I'm not sure I can move a boot drive to a secondary IDE position.
I am sure of is that this will screw up drive and partition (on the
W2K drive) identification, if attempted.

It's worked this way for a decade now, in spite of the ECS MB upgrade
in ~04, and the usual issues associated with the unsupported W98 OS.

I wonder if I'm not screwing up an expected disk mounting procedure or
sequence by reviving the source HDD to occasionally check mail etc on
the system in question.... It's hard to deal with the no-boot
situation.


You're being a bit over-descriptive and making it difficult to follow
what jumper settings you're using on each of the new drives in the
different scenarios you are trying. By interjecting into the dialog
what was set and what was working with the old drives, the new settings
are being obfuscated.

JUST state clearly without extra conjecture, when ONLY the new drives
are installed, what size/model each drive is (I don't care what OS is on
each) on what connector (Master or slave connector) of which channel
(primary or secondary) and in each instance, which jumper setting is
being used on each drive. Report this in the form of a series of lists
so we can see what you are setting in each case.

So far none of this has been made clear, nor do I see whether you have
tried the drives in different positions relative to the connectors and
channels.

For example, state something like:
*160GB / WD1600AAJB-00PVA0 connected to master cable connector of primay
IDE channel, jumper set to "master w/ slave present"
*160GB / WD1600AAJB-00PVA0 connected to slave cable connector of primay
IDE channel, jumper set to "slave"
Result: does not boot even to BIOS setup, no display on screen.

Then go on to the next configuration tried and the results, and so on.

--
Glen Ventura
MS MVP Oct. 2002 - Sept. 2009
CompTIA A+
http://dts-l.net/

  #29  
Old November 4th 10, 04:16 AM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion
legg
External Usenet User
 
Posts: 187
Default HDD upgrade - no boot - 48LBA? KM400-M2

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 17:56:06 -0400, 98 Guy wrote:

Your computer's clock is off by an hour, btw.

legg wrote:

I have the W98 2ed normally in primary master, the W2K SP4 in
primary slave positions. Optical and bulk data on the secondary
IDE.

The 80G drives are WD WD800JB-00JJC0 ca 2006
The new drives are WD WD1600AAJB-00PVA0 ca 2008

As suggested by Mr.Blanton and recently noted to him, the new
drives will boot if the primary slave position is vacant.


So you are replacing two 80-gb drives with two 160-gb drives - yes?

Both connected on the same ribbon cable to the motherboard primary IDE
connector?

And the motherboard won't boot with that setup?

Boot a DOS floppy with fdisk and run fdisk and choose option (5) to see
what drive choices it presents to you. Then choose option (4) and check
to see that there is at least one partition or volume on the desired
boot drive that is marked with "A" under the Status column. "A" means
"Active", as in it's a bootable partition or volume.

If you can't boot a DOS floppy with both 160 gb drives connected as
master/slave, then move one of the drives to the second IDE interface
and try again.

I have used MANY of the 80-gb Western Digital drives, and quite a few of
the 320 gb drives, but I don't think I've ever had my hands on the 160
gb versions. I have a few Seagate 160 gb drives - but they're SATA.


I stuck the 'new' W98 Hdd in sec slave, as suggested, with the source
w98 hdd in primary master, and w2K in primary slave and booted up into
the usual W2K alt OS. W2K disc management shows the old W98 as H:,
healthy and boot; the new drive as C:, healthy and active.

Swap around their positions, as WDLG intended, and there's no boot.
Should be able to do something with the W2K recovery console, if I can
only figure out what that is.

RL
  #30  
Old November 4th 10, 04:30 AM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion
98 Guy
External Usenet User
 
Posts: 2,951
Default HDD upgrade - no boot - 48LBA? KM400-M2

There are some very knowledgable people in the win-98 forum on msfn.org,
particularly when it comes to hard drives and boot-ability.

http://www.msfn.org/board/forum/8-windows-959898seme/

I suggest you register on msfn and post this issue there.

Otherwise, try posting to:

alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt
comp.sys.ibm.oc.hardware.storage
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Upgrade from Windows 98 English to Windows Me Upgrade EDTN in Hebr Idanbjacobs General 1 October 25th 08 07:37 PM
Windows 98 Boot.ini/Boot loader disiperance dragonfly General 2 June 5th 07 10:53 AM
Restore Win98 boot from dual boot Michael Fisher General 2 February 4th 07 04:48 AM
with oem 98 can not get a windows 98se upgrade disk and do an upgrade at all DJW Setup & Installation 8 November 26th 06 04:00 PM
me boot and safe mode boot problems knacked General 2 February 5th 05 04:09 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 06:38 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 Win98banter.
The comments are property of their posters.