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Running an old DOS program



 
 
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  #21  
Old March 9th 12, 01:22 AM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion,microsoft.public.windowsxp.general
Bill in Co
External Usenet User
 
Posts: 701
Default Running an old DOS program

Ken Springer wrote:
On 3/8/12 2:35 PM, Fritz Wuehler wrote:
I know of no reason you couldn't load DOS 7.1 into Virtual Box.


You can load it but it will not work 100%. Depending on what you need,
VirtualBox, QEMU etc. do not work very well with DOS. Many programs like
Borland TASM, and MS MASM crash the VM.


Maybe a simpler and easier route would be to go to the pawn shop,
Goodwill, flea markets, etc. and buy a desktop that will run DOS without
jumping through hoops.


The other problem (which is often a big problem, particularly with games),
is being able to slow down the programs to run properly (i.e. usably) on a
current system. There are some programs that "steal" CPU cycles to try to
accomplish this, but they often don't work too well.


  #22  
Old March 9th 12, 01:33 AM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion,microsoft.public.windowsxp.general
Lostgallifreyan
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,562
Default Running an old DOS program

Sjouke Burry s@b wrote in
. 10:

Well, on my old computers i use svgacc.lib for graphics
in C and fortran, and i have 16, 256, and rgb color available,
and all without special drivers( et4000 and et6000 xvga cards).
It is downright disappointing to see a "mode not supported" square
floating across the screen.


But that's like my laser scanner on a sound card, where its WDM driver can
set exact 50000 (or 60000, even 90000) samples per second to emulate an ILDA
standard for a fast galvo scanner. But I could only justify the expense of
'Widemoves' that only do maybe 18000 points (or samples) per second. I can
have slightly faster, at narrower scan angle, which is directly analogous to
higher VDU refresh at smaller resolutions, a compromise most us are familiar
with.

In short, there's a lot of difference between driver and hardware capability.
I guess if drivers had ways to spot video performance and scale back when
they see degradation, any number of things may have worked better, but I
don't think it ever happened. But it would be frustrating to be denied what
we know damn well should work.

If drivers could take settings as freely as we can assign sizes and colours
to bitmaps, we'd be ok, but I think the makers didn't want the complexity or
the risk of people burning out raster scan drive transistors, then blaming
the supplier for the freedom they got to hang themselves with. All
changing now with DVI-D and TFT LCD pixels, but old habits die hard...
  #24  
Old March 9th 12, 03:36 AM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion,microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,comp.os.msdos.programmer
Franc Zabkar
External Usenet User
 
Posts: 1,702
Default Running an old DOS program

On Thu, 8 Mar 2012 09:06:13 -0800 (PST), Industrial One
put finger to keyboard and composed:

So I download DOS 7.1, then what? Do I have to install this on a thumb
drive to boot from it, and then do I cd to the directory with the
program I wanna run?

The program is not a game, btw. It's an emulator that runs ROMs
(games).


You could boot DOS from a USB drive or CD, and then create a RAM disk
via a line in autoxec.bat. If your app requires TEMP space, then SET
the TEMP directory to your RAM disk. Otherwise, if your app writes to
some other directory on the disc, then copy your app to your RAM drive
and launch it from there instead. All this could be done automatically
via appropriate lines in autoexec.bat.

If you could be more specific, perhaps one of us could expand on this
for you.

BTW, how much disc space does your DOS app occupy and how much RAM
does it require?

- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
  #25  
Old March 9th 12, 05:07 PM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion,microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,comp.os.msdos.programmer
Industrial One
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 14
Default Running an old DOS program

On Mar 9, 2:36*am, Franc Zabkar wrote:
On Thu, 8 Mar 2012 09:06:13 -0800 (PST), Industrial One
put finger to keyboard and composed:

So I download DOS 7.1, then what? Do I have to install this on a thumb
drive to boot from it, and then do I cd to the directory with the
program I wanna run?


The program is not a game, btw. It's an emulator that runs ROMs
(games).


You could boot DOS from a USB drive or CD, and then create a RAM disk
via a line in autoxec.bat. If your app requires TEMP space, then SET
the TEMP directory to your RAM disk. Otherwise, if your app writes to
some other directory on the disc, then copy your app to your RAM drive
and launch it from there instead. All this could be done automatically
via appropriate lines in autoexec.bat.

If you could be more specific, perhaps one of us could expand on this
for you.

BTW, how much disc space does your DOS app occupy and how much RAM
does it require?


The application itself is around 300 KB, the roms are between 2 to 6
MB. RAM usage shouldn't be above 60 MB.

I set up DOS 7.1 with Virtualbox because this was more intuitive than
having to restart the comp every time to get around issues. This
virtualization **** is kinda cool, the only disappointing thing is the
fact that I can't browse my regular OS from it. The only way I could
copy files to the virtual DOS is making a CD ISO of the directory with
my app and loading from there.

This has failed, though. There is no sound and the emulator freezes
the moment I tried to load a game. How do you set color depth on
Virtualbox btw? It says its on 32-bit and needs 16-bit but I don't see
such option anywhere.
  #26  
Old March 9th 12, 05:33 PM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion,microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,comp.os.msdos.programmer
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4
Default Running an old DOS program

On Thu, 8 Mar 2012 09:06:13 -0800 (PST), Industrial One
wrote:

Okay so either boot into DOS or use a VM, which one would result in
faster performance? I'll assume DOS.

So I download DOS 7.1, then what? Do I have to install this on a thumb
drive to boot from it, and then do I cd to the directory with the
program I wanna run?

The program is not a game, btw. It's an emulator that runs ROMs
(games). Emulating an emulator with DOSBox was... an apalling
experience. Vegan hackers would probably nail me to a cross for
wasting so much energy.

On Mar 8, 3:24*pm, 98 Guy wrote:
Why is this so hard for people to do?


Because I have no floppy drive.


Adding a floppy drive is pretty easy as long as there is a space in your
case for it. You can buy one on ebay for probably $10 or less.

Another option. There are old computers everywhere for free or a couple
bucks. Most still work. It's only MS that makes them worthless with
their newest bloated OSs. Just get a second computer. Watch craigslist
and local garage sales and auctions.

I'm posting this from a Win98 computer. I still have Dos. I refuse to
use any MS bloatware without dos. I have XP on one computer and never
use it. You couldn't give me Vista or Win7 for free. I still use lots
of Dos apps.

---
Just because MS wants me to throw my old computer in the trash and
upgrade to their latest bloatware, dont mean I will. MS is not my
employer, school teacher, or parent! Win98 is the only OS made by MS
that was worth anything. After 98, they began creating garbage!


  #28  
Old March 9th 12, 06:40 PM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion,microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,comp.os.msdos.programmer
Lostgallifreyan
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,562
Default Running an old DOS program

wrote in :

Just because MS wants me to throw my old computer in the trash and
upgrade to their latest bloatware, dont mean I will. MS is not my
employer, school teacher, or parent! Win98 is the only OS made by MS
that was worth anything. After 98, they began creating garbage!


I agree. But I'm posting to say somethign slightly different on the basic
theme... M$ 'deprecate' stuff, and even if you look up API details on their
site they try to tell us that stuff is only applicable to WXP, etc... This is
nonsense, most of it comes from W95's time, and runs equally well on every OS
since. And on Wine in Linux too. Hopefully M$ will realise that it's stupid
to 'deprecate', in a world wher firms generally trade on any solid history
they can get. Never mind the fact that code doesn't improve with age like
wine and whisky, it's still nearly 20 years of well-established code base
that they could be proud of, and acknowledge that past as a strength instead
of trying to make us all throw it away. If they don't value it, eventually
profit will go to those who do. At which point, W98 might be seen as a very
desirable system in some contexts, rather than a curiosity that many let
themselves beleive meant nothing anymore.
  #29  
Old March 9th 12, 07:34 PM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion,microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,comp.os.msdos.programmer
Zaphod Beeblebrox
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10
Default Running an old DOS program

In article ,
says...

On Thu, 8 Mar 2012 09:06:13 -0800 (PST), Industrial One
wrote:

Okay so either boot into DOS or use a VM, which one would result in
faster performance? I'll assume DOS.

So I download DOS 7.1, then what? Do I have to install this on a thumb
drive to boot from it, and then do I cd to the directory with the
program I wanna run?

The program is not a game, btw. It's an emulator that runs ROMs
(games). Emulating an emulator with DOSBox was... an apalling
experience. Vegan hackers would probably nail me to a cross for
wasting so much energy.

On Mar 8, 3:24*pm, 98 Guy wrote:
Why is this so hard for people to do?


Because I have no floppy drive.


Adding a floppy drive is pretty easy as long as there is a space in your
case for it. You can buy one on ebay for probably $10 or less.


Many newer computers do not have a floppy controller on the
motherboard, so it isn't always quite that easy. Also, the last
company that makes one of the critical components necessary to
manufacture floppy drives has discontinued that product, so the floppy
drives currently on the market right now are all that there are ever
going to be (unless someone commissions them to make another batch,
which seems unlikely).

--
Zaphod

The secret of flying is to hurl yourself to the ground, and miss.
  #30  
Old March 10th 12, 02:23 AM posted to microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion,microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,comp.os.msdos.programmer
dg1261
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1
Default Running an old DOS program

Lostgallifreyan wrote in
:

That could ease the situation in the long run, but only when it has
driven people to make good low level virtual machines. But when they
do, the idea of any OS being 'obsolete' will vanish, because people
will no longer need to guard against hardware becoming unavailable to
run them, and they can use whatever suits them so long as some virtual
machine will run it on the hardware they want. This is an ideal
method, just not one we have much of, yet. Most VM's are still too
high-level, too OS dependent. Silly really, given that 32 bit
protected mode (and the Tenberry version used by Partition Magic, etc)
are all low level, showing that it can be done.

I have nice dreamy visions of multiple cores running one HUGELY fast
W98. All that raw power there for programs instead of the OS
chewing lots of it... Or one fast new machine allowing two virtual
computers to run on one VM layer. The VM would in effect be one big
complex static VXD driver, and the computers running on it would have
no idea they weren't on dedicated hardware made for them.



Yes, decoupling the computer from the hardware! That's where I thought
the industry was headed when I began using VMs 7 yrs ago. I've been
sadly disappointed. We should have been there by now.

I had visions of everyone carrying around their own personal "computer"
as a VM on a flash drive of some fashion, with the hardware computer
being merely a VM shell that the BIOS would boot straight into. You
could carry your own "PC" in your pocket, plug it into a VM shell at any
library, kiosk, coffee shop, or friend's house, and you'd instantly have
your own computer with your own OS and your own apps and everything.

Maybe I'm pessimistic, but now I feel we'll never get there. The
lemmings are stampeding to the Apple strategy of walled gardens, app
stores, and abdicating control of your machine to the corporate
establishment. Microsoft is following suit, as evidenced by their UEFI
BIOS and their change of course with Windows 8. Once the desktop PC
market becomes entrapped in the mobile way of doing things, it will be
too late to change.


 




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