Microsoft Responds to the Evolution of Online Communities

On 05/06/2010 11:06 PM, glee wrote:
"Franc Zabkar" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 04 May 2010 12:14:41 -0700 (UTC), put
finger to keyboard and composed:

Date 5/4/2010
Starting in early summer 2010, Microsoft will begin progressively
closing
down the Microsoft public newsgroups to enrich conversations in the
rapidly-growing forum platform.

I don't want a two-paragraph text based conversation to be "enriched"
by 1MB of Javascript, plus ads and banners, and other inducements and
enticements.

I should be able to exchange 10 lines of text using just a 2400bps
dialup modem on a 286 machine running any version of DOS.

Thankfully, some technical forums have RSS feeds, and many will
deliver replies and notifications via email.

These days I make much greater use of OB1 (no JS support), and I visit
Google's cached text-only version of certain web sites whenever
possible.

This decision is in response to worldwide
market trends and evolving customer needs.

This decision is in response to consumer ignorance. Most customers
have never heard of Usenet, or an email client. They think they need
web based interfaces for everything, including email, and they carry
on their vacuous lives via Facebook and Twitter.


In the eternal-september.org (E-S) support group on their server, "Joe
Banana", who AFAICT runs the newsserver, had this comment in response to
questions about continuing to carry the MS groups:

quote
"Microsoft has never bothered to issue control messages for its
microsoft.* groups and I assume they will just switch off their servers
and leave the mess behind that they have been inflicting on Usenet for
more than fifteen years. Right now, there are 1772 microsoft.public.*
groups on E-S and many of them are empty or just filled with spam.

"As Microsoft will not create new "official" groups or remove obsolete
groups on its own servers anymore, Julièn Élie will consequentially stop
issuing "virtual" checkgroups control messages for the microsoft.*
hierarchy and hence it's in the sole discretion of each NSP to decide which
microsoft.* groups, if any, they are going to carry after Microsoft will
finally FOAD Usenet-wise, which will inevitably lead to inconsistent
group lists and will definitely not improve the usability of this
hierarchy. It would take enormous efforts to restructure the namespace,
cut back the proliferations of Microsoft's naming conventions and make
it Usenet compliant, so I doubt this can be achieved without a
maintainer. With all this in mind, I would suggest to abandon the
microsoft.* mess as FUBAR and create a set of newsgroups within and in
accordance with the rules of the existing and established hierarchies. "
/quote


And that makes sense to me... though I'm not exactly sure, nor is
apparently "Joe Banana", what will actually be done when this service
and hosting ends, nor what Microsoft will do "this time" with this
complete closure. I also disagree with "Microsoft has never bothered to
issue control messages", compliant services removed those groups when
"refreshed".
Microsoft may ignore the continuance as it has before allowing supposed
users a "forum"; it may issue the control message(s); it may do...;
whatever Microsoft does, and who ever actually knows everything
Microsoft will do even WITHIN Microsoft. Things change constantly, one
department changes another's intents, and we have seen retractions and
modifications from even those supposedly "in control". So in this
instance I think it will be interesting to see exactly what IS done
since Microsoft has never followed many of the "standards" which apply
to the Web, and elsewhere.

--
MEB
http://peoplescounsel.org/ref/windows-main.htm
Windows Info, Diagnostics, Security, Networking
http://peoplescounsel.org
The "real world" of Law, Justice, and Government
___---

"glee" wrote in
:

"Franc Zabkar" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 04 May 2010 12:14:41 -0700 (UTC),
put finger to keyboard and composed:

SNIP

This decision is in response to worldwide
market trends and evolving customer needs.

This decision is in response to consumer ignorance. Most
customers have never heard of Usenet, or an email client.
They think they need web based interfaces for everything,
including email, and they carry on their vacuous lives via
Facebook and Twitter.

In the eternal-september.org (E-S) support group on their
server, "Joe Banana", who AFAICT runs the newsserver, had
this comment in response to questions about continuing to
carry the MS groups:

quote
"Microsoft has never bothered to issue control messages for
its microsoft.* groups and I assume they will just switch
off their servers and leave the mess behind that they have
been inflicting on Usenet for more than fifteen years.
Right now, there are 1772 microsoft.public.* groups on E-S
and many of them are empty or just filled with spam.

"As Microsoft will not create new "official" groups or
remove obsolete groups on its own servers anymore, Julièn
Élie will consequentially stop issuing "virtual"
checkgroups control messages for the microsoft.* hierarchy
and hence it's in the sole discretion of each NSP to decide
which
microsoft.* groups, if any, they are going to carry after
Microsoft will finally FOAD Usenet-wise, which will
inevitably lead to inconsistent group lists and will
definitely not improve the usability of this hierarchy. It
would take enormous efforts to restructure the namespace,
cut back the proliferations of Microsoft's naming
conventions and make it Usenet compliant, so I doubt this
can be achieved without a maintainer. With all this in
mind, I would suggest to abandon the microsoft.* mess as
FUBAR and create a set of newsgroups within and in
accordance with the rules of the existing and established
hierarchies. " /quote

Beautifully said!



--
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is
time to pause and reflect."
- Mark Twain

"glee" wrote in
:

"Franc Zabkar" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 04 May 2010 12:14:41 -0700 (UTC),
put finger to keyboard and composed:

SNIP

This decision is in response to worldwide
market trends and evolving customer needs.

This decision is in response to consumer ignorance. Most
customers have never heard of Usenet, or an email client.
They think they need web based interfaces for everything,
including email, and they carry on their vacuous lives via
Facebook and Twitter.

In the eternal-september.org (E-S) support group on their
server, "Joe Banana", who AFAICT runs the newsserver, had
this comment in response to questions about continuing to
carry the MS groups:

quote
"Microsoft has never bothered to issue control messages for
its microsoft.* groups and I assume they will just switch
off their servers and leave the mess behind that they have
been inflicting on Usenet for more than fifteen years.
Right now, there are 1772 microsoft.public.* groups on E-S
and many of them are empty or just filled with spam.

"As Microsoft will not create new "official" groups or
remove obsolete groups on its own servers anymore, Julièn
Élie will consequentially stop issuing "virtual"
checkgroups control messages for the microsoft.* hierarchy
and hence it's in the sole discretion of each NSP to decide
which
microsoft.* groups, if any, they are going to carry after
Microsoft will finally FOAD Usenet-wise, which will
inevitably lead to inconsistent group lists and will
definitely not improve the usability of this hierarchy. It
would take enormous efforts to restructure the namespace,
cut back the proliferations of Microsoft's naming
conventions and make it Usenet compliant, so I doubt this
can be achieved without a maintainer. With all this in
mind, I would suggest to abandon the microsoft.* mess as
FUBAR and create a set of newsgroups within and in
accordance with the rules of the existing and established
hierarchies. " /quote

Beautifully said!



--
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is
time to pause and reflect."
- Mark Twain

MEB wrote in
:

SNIP

Microsoft may ignore the continuance as it has before
allowing supposed users a "forum"; it may issue the control
message(s); it
may do...; whatever Microsoft does, and who ever actually
knows everything Microsoft will do even WITHIN Microsoft.

On does wonder how it even works at all, MS that is...

Things change constantly, one department changes another's
intents, and we have seen retractions and modifications
from even those supposedly "in control".

It is possibly one of the worst-managed companies in the world.
Still, very profitable. I worked for a total nutjob once, and he
never had a losing year either. Go figure. Dementia = success?

So in this
instance I think it will be interesting to see exactly what
IS done since Microsoft has never followed many of the
"standards" which apply to the Web, and elsewhere.

In fairness, they did issue a variety of guidelines in the early
days (especially for Windows software writers) which most people
did not bother with, ergo the dozens of keyboard shortcuts for
"save file as", and other similar delights...

One of my partitions is almost ready to be Linuxed (flummoxed?).



--
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is
time to pause and reflect."
- Mark Twain

MEB wrote in
:

SNIP

Microsoft may ignore the continuance as it has before
allowing supposed users a "forum"; it may issue the control
message(s); it
may do...; whatever Microsoft does, and who ever actually
knows everything Microsoft will do even WITHIN Microsoft.

On does wonder how it even works at all, MS that is...

Things change constantly, one department changes another's
intents, and we have seen retractions and modifications
from even those supposedly "in control".

It is possibly one of the worst-managed companies in the world.
Still, very profitable. I worked for a total nutjob once, and he
never had a losing year either. Go figure. Dementia = success?

So in this
instance I think it will be interesting to see exactly what
IS done since Microsoft has never followed many of the
"standards" which apply to the Web, and elsewhere.

In fairness, they did issue a variety of guidelines in the early
days (especially for Windows software writers) which most people
did not bother with, ergo the dozens of keyboard shortcuts for
"save file as", and other similar delights...

One of my partitions is almost ready to be Linuxed (flummoxed?).



--
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is
time to pause and reflect."
- Mark Twain

On 05/07/2010 12:27 AM, thanatoid wrote:
MEB wrote in
:

SNIP

Microsoft may ignore the continuance as it has before
allowing supposed users a "forum"; it may issue the control
message(s); it
may do...; whatever Microsoft does, and who ever actually
knows everything Microsoft will do even WITHIN Microsoft.

On does wonder how it even works at all, MS that is...

Things change constantly, one department changes another's
intents, and we have seen retractions and modifications
from even those supposedly "in control".

It is possibly one of the worst-managed companies in the world.
Still, very profitable. I worked for a total nutjob once, and he
never had a losing year either. Go figure. Dementia = success?

shrug I suppose that could be...


So in this
instance I think it will be interesting to see exactly what
IS done since Microsoft has never followed many of the
"standards" which apply to the Web, and elsewhere.

In fairness, they did issue a variety of guidelines in the early
days (especially for Windows software writers) which most people
did not bother with, ergo the dozens of keyboard shortcuts for
"save file as", and other similar delights...

They had to issue those, most users complained when all their previous
keyboard "shortcuts" from things like Lotus Notes, *nix editors,
WordPerfect, and the like, "disagreed" with Microsoft's, and many
windows "programmers" had no clue or concern; so I don't know whether
those would actually count.


One of my partitions is almost ready to be Linuxed (flummoxed?).




Shouldn't be messed up, just follow what your supposed to when
multi-booting. Might want to look carefully at Grub/Lilo/whatever
bootloader is involved and what is required FIRST. AND how to return to
any prior bootloader should that be involved. Those who prepare FIRST
generally have the least problems [as if you need that "bit-o-wisdom" ;}].

--
MEB
http://peoplescounsel.org/ref/windows-main.htm
Windows Info, Diagnostics, Security, Networking
http://peoplescounsel.org
The "real world" of Law, Justice, and Government
___---

On 05/07/2010 12:27 AM, thanatoid wrote:
MEB wrote in
:

SNIP

Microsoft may ignore the continuance as it has before
allowing supposed users a "forum"; it may issue the control
message(s); it
may do...; whatever Microsoft does, and who ever actually
knows everything Microsoft will do even WITHIN Microsoft.

On does wonder how it even works at all, MS that is...

Things change constantly, one department changes another's
intents, and we have seen retractions and modifications
from even those supposedly "in control".

It is possibly one of the worst-managed companies in the world.
Still, very profitable. I worked for a total nutjob once, and he
never had a losing year either. Go figure. Dementia = success?

shrug I suppose that could be...


So in this
instance I think it will be interesting to see exactly what
IS done since Microsoft has never followed many of the
"standards" which apply to the Web, and elsewhere.

In fairness, they did issue a variety of guidelines in the early
days (especially for Windows software writers) which most people
did not bother with, ergo the dozens of keyboard shortcuts for
"save file as", and other similar delights...

They had to issue those, most users complained when all their previous
keyboard "shortcuts" from things like Lotus Notes, *nix editors,
WordPerfect, and the like, "disagreed" with Microsoft's, and many
windows "programmers" had no clue or concern; so I don't know whether
those would actually count.


One of my partitions is almost ready to be Linuxed (flummoxed?).




Shouldn't be messed up, just follow what your supposed to when
multi-booting. Might want to look carefully at Grub/Lilo/whatever
bootloader is involved and what is required FIRST. AND how to return to
any prior bootloader should that be involved. Those who prepare FIRST
generally have the least problems [as if you need that "bit-o-wisdom" ;}].

--
MEB
http://peoplescounsel.org/ref/windows-main.htm
Windows Info, Diagnostics, Security, Networking
http://peoplescounsel.org
The "real world" of Law, Justice, and Government
___---

Usenet you not Microsoft but COPY CATS of microsoft.public

" Sunny" wrote in message
...

"Hot-text" wrote in message
...

Sunny The Usenet is run by thousands of news servers COPY CATS of the
MAJOR servers !

Bull****, no one server runs Usenet.
Name your "Major Servers"

No it's What has Usenet have to do with Microsoft!
news.aioe.org is a Copy Cat, I do not Post on aioe if you see a Post there
by me it was Copy from microsoft.public ...
Now I will Post this on aioe Just for you look for the Subject is COPY CAT

"Sunny" wrote in message
...

"MEB" wrote in message
...
I'm also going to suggest again that Usenetters need to seriously
consider cleaning up your "end", or you may not have an "end" anymore
nor support.

What has Google got to do with Usenet?
(Except as a poor web based method of posting to Usenet servers.)

BTW, it only takes 5 minutes for any posts through any of the four NNTP
Servers, that I use. for them to appear on MS server.

No it's What has Usenet have to do with Microsoft!
news.aioe.org is a Copy Cat, I do not Post on aioe if you see a Post there
by me it was Copy from microsoft.public ...
Now I will Post this on aioe Just for you look for the Subject is COPY CAT

"Sunny" wrote in message
...

"MEB" wrote in message
...
I'm also going to suggest again that Usenetters need to seriously
consider cleaning up your "end", or you may not have an "end" anymore
nor support.

What has Google got to do with Usenet?
(Except as a poor web based method of posting to Usenet servers.)

BTW, it only takes 5 minutes for any posts through any of the four NNTP
Servers, that I use. for them to appear on MS server.