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Tablet machines and W9X?
I had an idea that a large-ish tablet might also have standard mouse and
keyboard sockets, effectively making it a standard PC with fairly high screen resolutions. I need to run W98 SE on it, even if I also run other OS's on it. Is this possible, or are they all ARM CPU's and suchlike, not compatible enough to be used like this? I want to find a cheap portable way to use W98. The main unit must be solid, likely to withstand being treated like a large book, and not an open tray of 144 eggs! So laptops are out of the question, those thin screens and vulnerable hinges will not do. I'm very unfamilar with what might be ideal, or cheap (ideally both), so any suggestions count so long as they are based on experience with something. I want to avoid finding out the hard way, if something looks awesome, but breaks if I breath on it thw wrong way. If it's as abuse resistant as a good ELO touchscreen, so much the better, but I do not need it to be a touchscreen. It just has to be a screen and CPU in one piece (no hinges), be portable, and strong enough to stand a lot of use. |
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Tablet machines and W9X?
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#3
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Tablet machines and W9X?
On 18 Mar 2012, Lostgallifreyan wrote:
About the kind of machine I want, I'm amazed they haven't existed for years! A vertically oriented or leaning surface is much more easily cooled than a flat one that is insulated or even heated on one side. Fitting a screen on a hinge is harder to engineer than fitting it into a deck and covering it with a tough transparent layer that is easily and cheaply replaced if scratched. Spare acrylic sheets could have cost little more than a fiver! People would have paid ten, and the makers could have made good money out of that. The box could have had rubber grips on one edge, and a pull-out bracket on the back like a photo-frame, and have standard keyboard sockets (or Bluetooth) and been supplied with a small travel keyboard, leaving the user with more choice later. It might not have been the best idea for ACTUAL laptop use, but it would have been better almost everywhere else. It could also have been a more ideal fusion between desktop and portable machines, yet apparently no-one considered it! At least, not until about 15 years, more like 20, after it became practical to build them. Now, EVERYONE seems to want one, some will risk looting a shop to get one! The question is, why didn't they want one before? Did makers just tell they they didn't, and make them somehow beleive it? They HAVE existed for a while, I own one of these from the mid 90s for example: http://www.toshiba-europe.com/bv/com...ucts/notebooks /t200/index.shtm It has a standard serial, VGA and PS/2 keyboard port but the parallel port is miniaturised. It's a fairly tough (and weighty) machine but probably far underpowered for what you want. -- __ __ #_ |\| | _# |
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Tablet machines and W9X?
Computer Nerd Kev wrote in
: On 18 Mar 2012, Lostgallifreyan wrote: About the kind of machine I want, I'm amazed they haven't existed for years! A vertically oriented or leaning surface is much more easily cooled than a flat one that is insulated or even heated on one side. Fitting a screen on a hinge is harder to engineer than fitting it into a deck and covering it with a tough transparent layer that is easily and cheaply replaced if scratched. Spare acrylic sheets could have cost little more than a fiver! People would have paid ten, and the makers could have made good money out of that. The box could have had rubber grips on one edge, and a pull-out bracket on the back like a photo-frame, and have standard keyboard sockets (or Bluetooth) and been supplied with a small travel keyboard, leaving the user with more choice later. It might not have been the best idea for ACTUAL laptop use, but it would have been better almost everywhere else. It could also have been a more ideal fusion between desktop and portable machines, yet apparently no-one considered it! At least, not until about 15 years, more like 20, after it became practical to build them. Now, EVERYONE seems to want one, some will risk looting a shop to get one! The question is, why didn't they want one before? Did makers just tell they they didn't, and make them somehow beleive it? They HAVE existed for a while, I own one of these from the mid 90s for example: http://www.toshiba-europe.com/bv/com...ucts/notebooks /t200/index.shtm It has a standard serial, VGA and PS/2 keyboard port but the parallel port is miniaturised. It's a fairly tough (and weighty) machine but probably far underpowered for what you want. A bit.. But it does have a 'transflective' display which is good. For whatever reason, displays that will work in bright daylight or sunlight seem to have gone out of fashion. I think I came across the T200 in a seaarch a few months back (And some tiny DOS-based machines), when lookign for small machines that might run W98. MOst were allegedly decaying, or expensive museum pieces. That's what led me to my earlier conclusion, because that doesn't imply continuity. Laptops have plenty of that, but I never liked them. Eee machines are a rare exception. Lots of cheap power there. I just wish I could get that in a single deck, with a tough screen cover. A weird quirk of computer history is that people tended to try to separate the VDU from the CPU, and bind the keyboard to the VDU in portable machines. I think better results would have happened if pepole had tried to combine CPU and VDU wherever possible, and keep keyboards separate like most other peripherals. At least, applying this method to LCD's would have worked better, maybe not with CRT's, which may be why the bad logic persisted long after people got rid of CRT's. |
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Tablet machines and W9X?
Lostgallifreyan wrote in
: bind the keyboard to the VDU To the CPU, I mean... |
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Tablet machines and W9X?
In message ,
Lostgallifreyan writes: [] apparently no-one considered it! At least, not until about 15 years, more like 20, after it became practical to build them. Now, EVERYONE seems to want one, some will risk looting a shop to get one! The question is, why didn't they want one before? Did makers just tell they they didn't, and make them somehow beleive it? [] Basically, CPU + display in one unit. When the Ees and netbooks first started to appear, one or two appeared (may still be available) with the CPU box (including RAM and HD - most don't have an optical drive) in a little box, without display, but with standard - I think it's actually called VGA - fixings on the box, so that you could fix them to the back of a flat-screen monitor, using the holes on that monitor that were put there to allow wall-mounting. These would produce a fairly small and rigid unit. I guess they didn't really catch on because of the lack of small, battery-powered, monitors to attach them to. So-called all-in-one PCs do exist, but seem to be very much a niche market: you don't hear much about them, and they seem to have settled around the 18-22" size, for home users who want a neat system, rather than portable sizes. A bit.. But it does have a 'transflective' display which is good. For whatever reason, displays that will work in bright daylight or sunlight seem to have gone out of fashion. What I could never understand is why display manufacture (with the exception of whatever it is e-readers use) has persisted in fighting ambient light with brighter and brighter backlights: an LCD panel is basically transmissive, so I couldn't (still can't) understand why the option of using a diffuser (even a sheet of paper!), so that you could actually _use_ ambient light, has never been offered. Actually, I've seen it in one range of Sony cameras - the one I saw was one that had a floppy drive in it (!), but anyway, it had the backlight shine through a diffuser that extended to a strip at the top of the camera: if you were using it in bright conditions, you turn the backlight off, and sunlight comes down from the strip and you can see the monitor screen fine. But I've never seen anything similar on anything bigger (AFAIK even today's tablets all still use a backlight). My main reason for wondering about this was/is battery life: OK, today's backlights (I'm guessing mostly LEDs these days) are more efficient than when they first started using them (electroluminescents?), but the principle still applies. [] with a tough screen cover. A weird quirk of computer history is that people tended to try to separate the VDU from the CPU, and bind the keyboard to the VDU in portable machines. I think better results would have happened if pepole had tried to combine CPU and VDU wherever possible, and keep keyboards separate like most other peripherals. At least, applying this method to LCD's would have worked better, maybe not with CRT's, which may be why the bad logic persisted long after people got rid of CRT's. I think you're right. (All-in-one units with CRTs did exist - I think the Osborne 1 may even have run on batteries, it was certainly heavy enough! - the best example possibly being the original Amstrad word processor [even had most of the printer electronics in it!], but these were mostly aimed at reduction of number of boxes rather than portability, CRTs being both too heavy and too power-hungry for that to be a realistic aim [especially with the batteries of the day]). -- J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. -Arthur C Clarke, science fiction writer (1917- ) |
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Tablet machines and W9X?
"J. P. Gilliver (John)" wrote in
: When the Ees and netbooks first started to appear, one or two appeared (may still be available) with the CPU box (including RAM and HD - most don't have an optical drive) in a little box, without display, but with standard - I think it's actually called VGA - fixings on the box, so that you could fix them to the back of a flat-screen monitor, using the holes on that monitor that were put there to allow wall-mounting. That's a really good idea. I have a couple of smaller ELO monitors (12") that have those standard VESA bolt-hole fixings. (Not sure why it's called VESA, I thought that was some old video standard around 486 time...) A box like that might be the single best way I can make use of those. Anyway, if you (or anyone) can name me anything specific enough to reduce the hideous Google SNR I'll get onto it. |
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Tablet machines and W9X?
"J. P. Gilliver (John)" wrote in
: So-called all-in-one PCs do exist, but seem to be very much a niche market: you don't hear much about them, and they seem to have settled around the 18-22" size, for home users who want a neat system, rather than portable sizes. Expensive too, I just had a look... For that kind of money I'd do what I already do, get some good industrial standard kiosk-type open frame monitor, and an ITX, and put them in one box. I was going to, anyway, until I decided it would be too big and expensive to do. I bought a portable 3U rack cabinet, then decided I didn't want to cut it up so I put a bass guitar effect unit and preamp in there... Finding a balance between cheap and ideal is very awkward. My current best balance is NOT at all portable. |
#9
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Tablet machines and W9X?
"J. P. Gilliver (John)" wrote in
: What I could never understand is why display manufacture (with the exception of whatever it is e-readers use) has persisted in fighting ambient light with brighter and brighter backlights: an LCD panel is basically transmissive, so I couldn't (still can't) understand why the option of using a diffuser (even a sheet of paper!), so that you could actually _use_ ambient light, has never been offered. Indeed. I tried to work out one, but never found a display cheap AND good enough to warrant the effort and risk. It may be easier than I thought though. Basically, take the back off, as for accessing backlight tubes to replace them. Leave it off, placing a bright diffusing panel behind there to reflect sunlight up through the panel, and shroud the top so it doesn't overheat, and to prevent bright distractions around the periphert from makign it useless. The arrangement would be messy though. Either that, or neat, small, and useless because it won't gather enough light to evenly backlight the screen. Standard transflective LCD's for baclit monochrome graphics are good. I'm not sure if there is any specific reason why colour ones don't do the same thing. Colour rendering is NOT an issue, it can do that in the dark, in bright light it only has to be clear, with enough colour differentiation to be useful. Maybe colour isn't the problem, but contrast might be. When I had a small Dell PDA (X50V) I noticed that in sunlight I could detect a flickering that I can't see when it's backlit in a room. That might also have stopped them making it more reflective, but I think a bit more reflectivity at the expense of some backlight loss might have been a better compromise. Ten years ago firms really DID design a machine with thought for outside use, these days they all seem to think we're only allowed to use them in homes and offices, and treat the sun as if it's their worst enemy. |
#10
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Tablet machines and W9X?
In message ,
Lostgallifreyan writes: "J. P. Gilliver (John)" wrote in : When the Ees and netbooks first started to appear, one or two appeared (may still be available) with the CPU box (including RAM and HD - most don't have an optical drive) in a little box, without display, but with standard - I think it's actually called VGA - fixings on the box, so that you could fix them to the back of a flat-screen monitor, using the holes on that monitor that were put there to allow wall-mounting. That's a really good idea. I have a couple of smaller ELO monitors (12") that have those standard VESA bolt-hole fixings. (Not sure why it's called VESA, I thought that was some old video standard around 486 time...) A box like that (I _think_ I remember it as long cards that plugged into - I think - PCI [might have been ISA!] slots but had an extra connector further out. But that could have been something else.) might be the single best way I can make use of those. Anyway, if you (or anyone) can name me anything specific enough to reduce the hideous Google SNR I'll get onto it. Netbox seems to be the keyword, though Asus have now made theirs with little legs. But the MSI Wind one - which I suspect is no longer in production, but you might be able to find _something_ similar - was the one I was thinking of. See for example http://vr-zone.com/articles/official...pecs/6285.html A quick look on Ebay and elsewhere suggests they are rare though )-: -- J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf "When you go in for a job interview, I think a good thing to ask is if they ever press charges." - Jack Handey |
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