Can I get the ME install CD to only reformat the C partition, not theD?

that's a great idea, mike. It's a hell of a lot easier to find someone
who will let me remove their full size HD and connect a converter for
my laptop HD, than to find someone willing to let me OPEN their laptop
and take the HD out, simply because desktops are MADE to be opened and
worked on easily, and laptops are not.

As long as I wouldn't have to do arcane stuff like set jumpers or
whatever, and it's a simple matter of switching the 3.5 inch HD for a
2.5" one on a converter, that will be my second choice if Shane's idea
of getting a DOS prompt onto my HD by copying it over doesn't work.

Mart No Spam,

Actually, on this laptop, the touchpad is broken, the keyboard is
broken, as well as the CD and floppy drives. And I don't use the modem
or any other stuff like PCMCIA or Ethernet, so don't need them to
function. All I need Windows to detect is the motherboard, serial
mouse, and to support an external PS2 keyboard, and the video driver,
which is pretty standard and should be on the install CD.

That wouldn't be too difficult for Windows to detect, in your scenario
of letting Windows install completely on the laptop HD in the other
fellow's computer, instead of only the "copying files" stage, followed
by transferral of the HD to my laptop for the rest of the install,
would it?

Sorry if that's rather awkwardly written...

Besides Shane and Mike's suggestions - elsewhere - which you could try, then
"in theory" no, it "wouldn't be too difficult for Windows to detect (new
hardware)" but see later.

If you don't mind me saying so, you seem to be going to a lot of trouble
trying to salvage this laptop. I take it that when you initially stated that
your laptop was unbootable due to a recent crash, then we should have taken
the word "crash" more literally. Jeepers! - Some crash, some disaster!

However, if you regard it as an exercise to relieve boredom, then you have
nothing to lose. There worst case is that it wont work - but there may be a
pot of gold there somewhere and you will be able to pat yourself on the back
if you do manage to get it 'working?' again.

So, back to my suggestion. You asked :-

That wouldn't be too difficult for Windows to detect, in your scenario
of letting Windows install completely on the laptop HD in the other
fellow's computer, instead of only the "copying files" stage, followed
by transferral of the HD to my laptop for the rest of the install,
would it?

Personally, I would get the whole thing up and running on "the other
fellow's computer" first - at least you will know whether after the "crash",
the HDD is not damaged too. But it's up to you where you want to stop the
set-up process, you can always try again if it fails. I see no advantage in
stopping it early. Just "Remove" the unwanted drivers (for "the other
fellow's computer") in Device Manager.

You may also have to "disable" other odd items in either the BIOS or Device
Manager (e.g. touchpad) if they cause detection/driver issues when trying to
boot into Normal Mode on your own computer. Just suck-it-and-see. If
'special' drivers are needed, I'm not sure how you will be able to install
them (no CD-ROM or FDD) but cross that bridge if/when.

Good luck - you'll probably need some, but with a bit of patience, you
should get there - by whichever method of skinning the cat you care to
choose.

Mart


"Gumby" wrote in message
...
Mart No Spam,

Actually, on this laptop, the touchpad is broken, the keyboard is
broken, as well as the CD and floppy drives. And I don't use the modem
or any other stuff like PCMCIA or Ethernet, so don't need them to
function. All I need Windows to detect is the motherboard, serial
mouse, and to support an external PS2 keyboard, and the video driver,
which is pretty standard and should be on the install CD.

That wouldn't be too difficult for Windows to detect, in your scenario
of letting Windows install completely on the laptop HD in the other
fellow's computer, instead of only the "copying files" stage, followed
by transferral of the HD to my laptop for the rest of the install,
would it?

Sorry if that's rather awkwardly written...

Not always necessary to open up a desktop. I've got a cheap external box
that can be connected using either usb or firewire that can take anything
from a 5½" DVD writer, through a 3½" 1/3 height HD to a 2½" laptop drive.
My box comes with a basic IDE adapter which I then enhanced by buying at
around US$3 a pop an IDE/SATA adapter and an IDE/laptop IDE adapter. I
can drop virtually anything in the box and access it from a desktop, the
main drawback is if I need to test hardware is that due to the usb
interface the system cannot access the hardware directly and thus, for
example, is not able to see a disks SMART data/status or temperature.
--
Mike Maltby



Gumby wrote:

that's a great idea, mike. It's a hell of a lot easier to find someone
who will let me remove their full size HD and connect a converter for
my laptop HD, than to find someone willing to let me OPEN their laptop
and take the HD out, simply because desktops are MADE to be opened and
worked on easily, and laptops are not.

As long as I wouldn't have to do arcane stuff like set jumpers or
whatever, and it's a simple matter of switching the 3.5 inch HD for a
2.5" one on a converter, that will be my second choice if Shane's idea
of getting a DOS prompt onto my HD by copying it over doesn't work.

If anyone else is interested, this is the zip I propose to send Gumby -
although now that I've uploaded it he might as well just download it from
he

http://website.lineone.net/~shanebea...s/winmedos.zip

It is about 8MB. It contains a brief ReadMe but I should state here that
anyone who wanted to download this (for reference purposes) should scan the
zip with their up-to-date antivirus software before unzipping it.

Unzipped to Windows Millennium's C: drive will unhide Real Mode DOS,
although being set up for British English keyboards, users of other layouts
would be required to edit autoexec.bat and config.sys first, instructions
for which are contained in those files and alluded to in ReadMe.txt, while
MS-DOS 6.22's Country.txt is included for further reference. Users of U.S.
or Canadian English keyboard layouts already have half the work done for
them.

Shane





"Gumby" wrote in message
...
Really overwhelmed by all the helpful suggestions. Shane sent me an
email that, if I understood it correctly, might have a way to put
WinMeDos on my laptop HD by copying it over from an XP desktop. And
that this might enable me to get a DOS prompt when I boot the laptop.
If I could get a DOS prompt, then I could run setup from the ME
install CD that I previously copied to the D partition. That would be
the easiest and cheapest of all options to get this machine running
again.

You know, I must correct something I wrote earlier. Actually, the
fellow who previously installed Win ME on my laptop HD from another
computer did not put the HD into another laptop, but installed ME from
a laptop HD connector on an XP desktop. I wonder how he was able to do
that? Was it that the laptop HD was connected in such a way as to be a
slave to his desktop's C drive? I don't really know what "slave" drive
means, but that occurred to me as a possibility.

He did in fact install only the first stage of the install, the
"copying files" stage, then disconnected the laptop HD and put it in
my laptop, where it proceeded to detect my hardware upon restarting.

Bart, thanks for the suggestion but my laptop's CD drive does not
work, in addition to the nonfunctional floppy drive.

So I'm Arturo Seis???

Not sure how that happened!

Anyhow, I should add, that there are two batches that govern which mode Win
Me is in. MFD.BAT and WINME.BAT. They depend on the presence or absence of
mfd_mode.dat in the Windows dir.

If you run 'MFD' and mfd_mode.dat is *not* present, it copies the modified
command.com (x2), io.sys, regenv32.exe (the three files the hack modifies),
autoexec.bat, config.sys and msdos.sys over, then reboots the system,
whereupon it restarts with the Real Mode boot menu and all that entails.

If you run 'MFD' and mfd_mode.dat *is* present, all that happens is
autoexec.bat and config.sys in the root are copied over the archive copies
in %windir%\command, so that any edits may be easily saved to the copies
they are remade from the next time Real Mode is cycled off and back on
again.

If you run 'WINME' and mfd_mode.dat is not present, the batch exits without
doing anything. If you run 'WINME' and mfd_mode.dat *is* present, the
original files mentioned above - except for config.sys, which is by default
empty in Me, therefore an empty file called config.sys is created - are
copied back over the modified versions and again the system is rebooted.

Both batches work fully whether in Windows or Real Mode. The reboot command
used depends on whether a command to delete the swapfile completes or fails
(in Windows it will be in use and fail, so C:\WINDOWS\RUNDLL32.EXE
SHELL32.DLL,SHExitWindowsEx 2 is used).

While it is known that Microsoft wanted to wind down knowledge of the
existence of MS-DOS as they planned to phase it out, it is true what they
said about boot time taking longer when loading Windows via Real Mode DOS,
and with this hack it is still preferable to use Me in the default mode
except when access to Real Mode is specifically required. One doesn't really
have a need to boot to DOS on a whim, so having the menu there at every boot
is quite unnecessary.

Shane



"Arturo Seis" wrote in message
...
If anyone else is interested, this is the zip I propose to send Gumby -
although now that I've uploaded it he might as well just download it from
he

http://website.lineone.net/~shanebea...s/winmedos.zip

It is about 8MB. It contains a brief ReadMe but I should state here that
anyone who wanted to download this (for reference purposes) should scan
the
zip with their up-to-date antivirus software before unzipping it.

Unzipped to Windows Millennium's C: drive will unhide Real Mode DOS,
although being set up for British English keyboards, users of other
layouts
would be required to edit autoexec.bat and config.sys first, instructions
for which are contained in those files and alluded to in ReadMe.txt, while
MS-DOS 6.22's Country.txt is included for further reference. Users of U.S.
or Canadian English keyboard layouts already have half the work done for
them.

Shane





"Gumby" wrote in message
...
Really overwhelmed by all the helpful suggestions. Shane sent me an
email that, if I understood it correctly, might have a way to put
WinMeDos on my laptop HD by copying it over from an XP desktop. And
that this might enable me to get a DOS prompt when I boot the laptop.
If I could get a DOS prompt, then I could run setup from the ME
install CD that I previously copied to the D partition. That would be
the easiest and cheapest of all options to get this machine running
again.

You know, I must correct something I wrote earlier. Actually, the
fellow who previously installed Win ME on my laptop HD from another
computer did not put the HD into another laptop, but installed ME from
a laptop HD connector on an XP desktop. I wonder how he was able to do
that? Was it that the laptop HD was connected in such a way as to be a
slave to his desktop's C drive? I don't really know what "slave" drive
means, but that occurred to me as a possibility.

He did in fact install only the first stage of the install, the
"copying files" stage, then disconnected the laptop HD and put it in
my laptop, where it proceeded to detect my hardware upon restarting.

Bart, thanks for the suggestion but my laptop's CD drive does not
work, in addition to the nonfunctional floppy drive.

Mart No Spam,

No, it wasn't a "crash" like dropping the laptop on the floor. Those
hardware items have all slowly broken over the years. I used "crash"
rather loosely. What actually happened, I think, is that a tear
developed in the laptop's internal HD connector ribbon, severing
several of the conductive thingies. This happened due to my habit of
removing the HD from the laptop every day when I went out, in order to
keep it from being stolen, as it was the only piece of hardware in my
dilapidated laptop that anyone would want to steal, had lots of
personal info on it (this was a concern before I learned recently to
encrypt) and for several years I've lived in hotels in various Third
World countries where hotel rooms are not safe places to leave
valuables. My laptop's been "open" for several years...i.e., the top
cover is removed and the HD would be simple to steal.

One day, after about 20 attempts to boot my computer which resulted in
"no operating system found" errors, it suddenly booted. But then after
an hour or so I got a blue screen. I think what happened is those torn
conductive thingies must have touched briefly, long enough for me to
start the computer, and then came apart again. Anyway, after that, I
could not boot it, and Windows apparently went bonkers as there were
all sorts of crazy files in my HD's Windows folder with bizarre names.
I fixed these with Scandisk on an XP computer. Then I found someone
who claimed he could actually fix the ribbon connector. He soldered
it, and I think it works now, but still the system will not boot, it
says that it can't find various essential files...so Windows was
fatally damaged by the incident, I suspect.

So...that's the "crash" ... you see why I tried to simplify a rather
involved story... )

And it is a lot of work researching this, but it would be very helpful
to me if I had my computer for the last 2 months of the year. I
suppose it is a bit of a challenge as well.

And before someone asks, yes, if I can get the computer to work, I
will leave the HD in it and risk its theft, in order not to damage the
delicate HD ribbon connector. Now the HD has all my important stuff on
encrypted virtual drives, so its theft wouldn't be a great loss.

On Oct 21, 5:02*am, "Mike M" wrote:
Not always necessary to open up a desktop. *I've got a cheap external box
that can be connected using either usb or firewire that can take anything
from a 5½" DVD writer, through a 3½" 1/3 height HD to a 2½" laptop drive.

Yes Mike, but I don't think you could install an OS to it through USB,
it needs to be the C drive in most cases (or the D, as you mentioned),
to allow OS installation, right? USB external boxes usually show up as
G, H, I, J, etc. drives in my experience.

I read somewhere that it's possible to rename the External Box as the
C drive, but I imagine that would make Windows go nuts.

I'm sorry but you don't appear to have taken in what I said. Nowhere did
I say in my previous post anything about "installing", instead I simply
stated how to access a laptop drive using a desktop and an external usb
box and laptop IDE/full size IDE converter. In my case I did "install" an
OS but this was by first imaging the existing system from the old drive
and then restoring that image to the new drive. Nowhere did I say or
suggest that that was something you should consider.

I read somewhere that it's possible to rename the External Box as the
C drive, but I imagine that would make Windows go nuts.

Why do you want to do this? Not that it isn't a simple job with a modern
desktop but I can't think why you should want to do this. I've in a
number of posts made a suggestion as to how to clean install Win Me on
your laptop drive by copying the DOS boot files from the Win Me boot
floppy and the Win9x folder from the Win Me CD to the laptop drive using a
desktop and then restoring the drive to the laptop, booting to DOS and
then running setup. Shane has also made some suggestions.

May I make one final suggestion and that is that you now try some of the
various suggestions that have been made.
--
Mike Maltby



Gumby wrote:

On Oct 21, 5:02am, "Mike M" wrote:
Not always necessary to open up a desktop. I've got a cheap external
box that can be connected using either usb or firewire that can take
anything from a 5" DVD writer, through a 3" 1/3 height HD to a 2"
laptop drive.

Yes Mike, but I don't think you could install an OS to it through USB,
it needs to be the C drive in most cases (or the D, as you mentioned),
to allow OS installation, right? USB external boxes usually show up as
G, H, I, J, etc. drives in my experience.

I read somewhere that it's possible to rename the External Box as the
C drive, but I imagine that would make Windows go nuts.

This thread is getting confusing. It seems the problem has been solved if the
responses had been tried.
--
I mastered Wordstar graphics!


"Arturo Seis" wrote:

So I'm Arturo Seis???

Not sure how that happened!

Anyhow, I should add, that there are two batches that govern which mode Win
Me is in. MFD.BAT and WINME.BAT. They depend on the presence or absence of
mfd_mode.dat in the Windows dir.

If you run 'MFD' and mfd_mode.dat is *not* present, it copies the modified
command.com (x2), io.sys, regenv32.exe (the three files the hack modifies),
autoexec.bat, config.sys and msdos.sys over, then reboots the system,
whereupon it restarts with the Real Mode boot menu and all that entails.

If you run 'MFD' and mfd_mode.dat *is* present, all that happens is
autoexec.bat and config.sys in the root are copied over the archive copies
in %windir%\command, so that any edits may be easily saved to the copies
they are remade from the next time Real Mode is cycled off and back on
again.

If you run 'WINME' and mfd_mode.dat is not present, the batch exits without
doing anything. If you run 'WINME' and mfd_mode.dat *is* present, the
original files mentioned above - except for config.sys, which is by default
empty in Me, therefore an empty file called config.sys is created - are
copied back over the modified versions and again the system is rebooted.

Both batches work fully whether in Windows or Real Mode. The reboot command
used depends on whether a command to delete the swapfile completes or fails
(in Windows it will be in use and fail, so C:\WINDOWS\RUNDLL32.EXE
SHELL32.DLL,SHExitWindowsEx 2 is used).

While it is known that Microsoft wanted to wind down knowledge of the
existence of MS-DOS as they planned to phase it out, it is true what they
said about boot time taking longer when loading Windows via Real Mode DOS,
and with this hack it is still preferable to use Me in the default mode
except when access to Real Mode is specifically required. One doesn't really
have a need to boot to DOS on a whim, so having the menu there at every boot
is quite unnecessary.

Shane



"Arturo Seis" wrote in message
...
If anyone else is interested, this is the zip I propose to send Gumby -
although now that I've uploaded it he might as well just download it from
he

http://website.lineone.net/~shanebea...s/winmedos.zip

It is about 8MB. It contains a brief ReadMe but I should state here that
anyone who wanted to download this (for reference purposes) should scan
the
zip with their up-to-date antivirus software before unzipping it.

Unzipped to Windows Millennium's C: drive will unhide Real Mode DOS,
although being set up for British English keyboards, users of other
layouts
would be required to edit autoexec.bat and config.sys first, instructions
for which are contained in those files and alluded to in ReadMe.txt, while
MS-DOS 6.22's Country.txt is included for further reference. Users of U.S.
or Canadian English keyboard layouts already have half the work done for
them.

Shane





"Gumby" wrote in message
...
Really overwhelmed by all the helpful suggestions. Shane sent me an
email that, if I understood it correctly, might have a way to put
WinMeDos on my laptop HD by copying it over from an XP desktop. And
that this might enable me to get a DOS prompt when I boot the laptop.
If I could get a DOS prompt, then I could run setup from the ME
install CD that I previously copied to the D partition. That would be
the easiest and cheapest of all options to get this machine running
again.

You know, I must correct something I wrote earlier. Actually, the
fellow who previously installed Win ME on my laptop HD from another
computer did not put the HD into another laptop, but installed ME from
a laptop HD connector on an XP desktop. I wonder how he was able to do
that? Was it that the laptop HD was connected in such a way as to be a
slave to his desktop's C drive? I don't really know what "slave" drive
means, but that occurred to me as a possibility.

He did in fact install only the first stage of the install, the
"copying files" stage, then disconnected the laptop HD and put it in
my laptop, where it proceeded to detect my hardware upon restarting.

Bart, thanks for the suggestion but my laptop's CD drive does not
work, in addition to the nonfunctional floppy drive.