Win 98SE vs ME

Using Powerquest DriveImage 2002 in both 98SE and ME environments in same
PC. Using 3rd party boot manager. Both OSes are hidden from each other.
Using one to image the other. DI can see and save images to an XP NTFS
formatted partition which is one of my regular save locations. 98SE and ME,
however, cannot see this partition which is what I want. My problem
revolves around a firewire connected HD.

In 98SE, I must have the firewire drive on prior to booting 98SE and using
DI. If not, DI will show a critical error and close if the firewire drive
is energized after booting 98SE. In either case, 98SE doesn't care when I
disconnect and deenergize this firewire drive before shutdown or after.

In ME, makes no difference when I energize the firewire connected HD for DI
to work and save an image to this drive.

To further confuse the issue, if I energize the firewire drive prior to
booting ME, use the safe to disconnect icon to disconnect the drive and turn
off the firewire drive, ME protests unable to find the drive at shutdown.
However, if I energize the firewire drive after booting ME, then use the
safe to disconnect in the system tray to disconnect and turn off the
firewire drive, ME doesn't protest at shutdown about not finding the
firewire drive.

XP home edition has none of these problems with the firewire drive on same
PC.

98SE has all the USB and Firewire updates from MS.
ME has never seen the internet.

How can I fix this problem? Help with ME would be nice as the
windowsme.general newsgroup is useless.
--
Jonny

USB 2.0 and FireWire are often problematic in Win98 and Me because the are
not directly supported by those versions of Windows. They react differently
because the implementations are not perfected.

You don't have problems with XP because it supports both serial standards
fully.

It's something that you'll just have to live with.

Anyhow, why are you running 98 and Me when you have XP, which is far more
advanced and more stable than they are?

Eric,
PC Buyer Beware!
http://www.pcbuyerbeware.co.uk/

"Jonny" wrote:

Using Powerquest DriveImage 2002 in both 98SE and ME environments in same
PC. Using 3rd party boot manager. Both OSes are hidden from each other.
Using one to image the other. DI can see and save images to an XP NTFS
formatted partition which is one of my regular save locations. 98SE and ME,
however, cannot see this partition which is what I want. My problem
revolves around a firewire connected HD.

In 98SE, I must have the firewire drive on prior to booting 98SE and using
DI. If not, DI will show a critical error and close if the firewire drive
is energized after booting 98SE. In either case, 98SE doesn't care when I
disconnect and deenergize this firewire drive before shutdown or after.

In ME, makes no difference when I energize the firewire connected HD for DI
to work and save an image to this drive.

To further confuse the issue, if I energize the firewire drive prior to
booting ME, use the safe to disconnect icon to disconnect the drive and turn
off the firewire drive, ME protests unable to find the drive at shutdown.
However, if I energize the firewire drive after booting ME, then use the
safe to disconnect in the system tray to disconnect and turn off the
firewire drive, ME doesn't protest at shutdown about not finding the
firewire drive.

XP home edition has none of these problems with the firewire drive on same
PC.

98SE has all the USB and Firewire updates from MS.
ME has never seen the internet.

How can I fix this problem? Help with ME would be nice as the
windowsme.general newsgroup is useless.
--
Jonny

After reading your post, I am not sure what the problem is. You say you
want SE and ME to be able to see an NTFS partition but you describe
limitations in two obsolete systems that are not present in XP and
apparently can be worked around. Are you saying that working around the
limitations is not acceptable or that ME and SE have to be able to see the
NTFS partition?

--
Regards


Ron Badour, MS MVP for W98
Tips: http://home.satx.rr.com/badour
Knowledge Base Info:
http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?pr=kbinfo



"Jonny" wrote in message
...
Using Powerquest DriveImage 2002 in both 98SE and ME environments in same
PC. Using 3rd party boot manager. Both OSes are hidden from each other.
Using one to image the other. DI can see and save images to an XP NTFS
formatted partition which is one of my regular save locations. 98SE and
ME,
however, cannot see this partition which is what I want. My problem
revolves around a firewire connected HD.

In 98SE, I must have the firewire drive on prior to booting 98SE and using
DI. If not, DI will show a critical error and close if the firewire drive
is energized after booting 98SE. In either case, 98SE doesn't care when I
disconnect and deenergize this firewire drive before shutdown or after.

In ME, makes no difference when I energize the firewire connected HD for
DI
to work and save an image to this drive.

To further confuse the issue, if I energize the firewire drive prior to
booting ME, use the safe to disconnect icon to disconnect the drive and
turn
off the firewire drive, ME protests unable to find the drive at shutdown.
However, if I energize the firewire drive after booting ME, then use the
safe to disconnect in the system tray to disconnect and turn off the
firewire drive, ME doesn't protest at shutdown about not finding the
firewire drive.

XP home edition has none of these problems with the firewire drive on same
PC.

98SE has all the USB and Firewire updates from MS.
ME has never seen the internet.

How can I fix this problem? Help with ME would be nice as the
windowsme.general newsgroup is useless.
--
Jonny

You seem to have 2 separate issues. With Win98/ME, you are
at the mercy of the driver that comes with the firewire drive. Of
late, drivers for the older Windows versions have become worst
and worst as the focus has moved almost exclusively to XP
(which sucks by the way, as demonstrated by this latest
exploit, zero-day, which is now circulating all over and
apparently only affecting XP and Server 2003 despite early
false reports that all Windows versions are affected).

The second is that Win98/ME can't natively access NTFS
partitions. You would need something like the "Pro" version
of this: http://www.sysinternals.com/Utilitie...Windows98.html

It would be much easier to just repartition the firewire drive
so that you end up with one or two FAT32 partitions. You
may run into a 32Gb limit, though.

-BC

My excuse at the time for all the OSes was spreading the load for the
various apps I use. Surfing and email is usually in 98SE environment with
IE 6 and Outlook 2000.

I like to maintain at least one non internet contact OS, for local bank
account maintenance software, and for A/V translation/encoding and burning
to DVD.
--
Jonny
"Eric" wrote in message
...
USB 2.0 and FireWire are often problematic in Win98 and Me because the are
not directly supported by those versions of Windows. They react
differently
because the implementations are not perfected.

You don't have problems with XP because it supports both serial standards
fully.

It's something that you'll just have to live with.

Anyhow, why are you running 98 and Me when you have XP, which is far more
advanced and more stable than they are?

Eric,
PC Buyer Beware!
http://www.pcbuyerbeware.co.uk/

"Jonny" wrote:

Using Powerquest DriveImage 2002 in both 98SE and ME environments in
same
PC. Using 3rd party boot manager. Both OSes are hidden from each
other.
Using one to image the other. DI can see and save images to an XP NTFS
formatted partition which is one of my regular save locations. 98SE and
ME,
however, cannot see this partition which is what I want. My problem
revolves around a firewire connected HD.

In 98SE, I must have the firewire drive on prior to booting 98SE and
using
DI. If not, DI will show a critical error and close if the firewire
drive
is energized after booting 98SE. In either case, 98SE doesn't care when
I
disconnect and deenergize this firewire drive before shutdown or after.

In ME, makes no difference when I energize the firewire connected HD for
DI
to work and save an image to this drive.

To further confuse the issue, if I energize the firewire drive prior to
booting ME, use the safe to disconnect icon to disconnect the drive and
turn
off the firewire drive, ME protests unable to find the drive at
shutdown.
However, if I energize the firewire drive after booting ME, then use the
safe to disconnect in the system tray to disconnect and turn off the
firewire drive, ME doesn't protest at shutdown about not finding the
firewire drive.

XP home edition has none of these problems with the firewire drive on
same
PC.

98SE has all the USB and Firewire updates from MS.
ME has never seen the internet.

How can I fix this problem? Help with ME would be nice as the
windowsme.general newsgroup is useless.
--
Jonny

For the miscue on the NTFS partition thing, DI sees it and 98SE and ME
don't. That's a good thing.

Its the trivial differences between using the firewire drive on 98SE and ME
that would like to straighten out.
--
Jonny
"Ron Badour" wrote in message
...
After reading your post, I am not sure what the problem is. You say you
want SE and ME to be able to see an NTFS partition but you describe
limitations in two obsolete systems that are not present in XP and
apparently can be worked around. Are you saying that working around the
limitations is not acceptable or that ME and SE have to be able to see the
NTFS partition?

--
Regards


Ron Badour, MS MVP for W98
Tips: http://home.satx.rr.com/badour
Knowledge Base Info:
http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?pr=kbinfo



"Jonny" wrote in message
...
Using Powerquest DriveImage 2002 in both 98SE and ME environments in
same
PC. Using 3rd party boot manager. Both OSes are hidden from each
other.
Using one to image the other. DI can see and save images to an XP NTFS
formatted partition which is one of my regular save locations. 98SE and
ME,
however, cannot see this partition which is what I want. My problem
revolves around a firewire connected HD.

In 98SE, I must have the firewire drive on prior to booting 98SE and
using
DI. If not, DI will show a critical error and close if the firewire
drive
is energized after booting 98SE. In either case, 98SE doesn't care when
I
disconnect and deenergize this firewire drive before shutdown or after.

In ME, makes no difference when I energize the firewire connected HD for
DI
to work and save an image to this drive.

To further confuse the issue, if I energize the firewire drive prior to
booting ME, use the safe to disconnect icon to disconnect the drive and
turn
off the firewire drive, ME protests unable to find the drive at
shutdown.
However, if I energize the firewire drive after booting ME, then use the
safe to disconnect in the system tray to disconnect and turn off the
firewire drive, ME doesn't protest at shutdown about not finding the
firewire drive.

XP home edition has none of these problems with the firewire drive on
same
PC.

98SE has all the USB and Firewire updates from MS.
ME has never seen the internet.

How can I fix this problem? Help with ME would be nice as the
windowsme.general newsgroup is useless.
--
Jonny

The single NTFS partition is on a 200GB HD. I don't ever want ME or 98SE to
see this as is the case now. Only DI2002/version 6 can see the NTFS
partition as target for an image file. This is good.

The firewire drive is an ADS product. The firewire enclosure onboard hard
drive has been replaced with a WD 60GB version. Its one FAT32 partition.

The problems are of 98SE and ME access to the firewire drive during use by
DI. And when shutting down ME, as stated in the OP.
--
Jonny
"BC" wrote in message
oups.com...
You seem to have 2 separate issues. With Win98/ME, you are
at the mercy of the driver that comes with the firewire drive. Of
late, drivers for the older Windows versions have become worst
and worst as the focus has moved almost exclusively to XP
(which sucks by the way, as demonstrated by this latest
exploit, zero-day, which is now circulating all over and
apparently only affecting XP and Server 2003 despite early
false reports that all Windows versions are affected).

The second is that Win98/ME can't natively access NTFS
partitions. You would need something like the "Pro" version
of this: http://www.sysinternals.com/Utilitie...Windows98.html

It would be much easier to just repartition the firewire drive
so that you end up with one or two FAT32 partitions. You
may run into a 32Gb limit, though.

-BC

So the Firewire drive is Fat32, and that the NTFS partition
is on PC drive and only meant for XP use. That makes it
simple -- it's likely the driver that's at fault. If the intention
is to be able to store images of the Windows 98 and ME
partitions to the Firewire drive, then it really is all about
the quality/compatibility of the drivers. Also instead of
running Drive Image in Windows, see if it has a DOS-level
option that runs outside of Windows. I use an old verson
of Drive Image Pro for imaging Win98/ME/2K via a boot
floppy. (XP's modified NTFS doesn't work, though) I had
tried using USB DOS drivers to image to USB hard drives,
but there was no consistency whatsoever from PC to PC
doing this. It generally worked for older PC's but slowly,
and not at all for new ones. I tried Ghost off a Systemworks
2003 CD, but its USB DOS drivers were also unreliable.

I had much better luck using network boot floppies to
access a shared-out USB hard drive attached to a PC.
If this Firewire glitch is a major issue for you and if you
have another PC handy, imaging over the network might
be a better option -- attach the Firewire drive to the other
PC, share it out and then back up to it over the network.

-BC

I use windows as its 32 bit access is much faster for reads and writes. I
cannot access the firewire drive in msdos real mode from floppy drive boot.
Yes, I have the DI2002 boot floppy usability as well.

One spare PC with plain jane Pentium running ME. Has an operational NIC.
Was using it for a NAT firewall sharing internet access when I was connected
to cable. Since moving and going to telco, retired the PC.
Will have to hunt down a PS/2 keyboard and mouse, and alter the network
settings in ME. Go get the Cat5 cables and more. Nope, fix would be nice.
I'll just live with it.

--
Jonny
"BC" wrote in message
oups.com...
So the Firewire drive is Fat32, and that the NTFS partition
is on PC drive and only meant for XP use. That makes it
simple -- it's likely the driver that's at fault. If the intention
is to be able to store images of the Windows 98 and ME
partitions to the Firewire drive, then it really is all about
the quality/compatibility of the drivers. Also instead of
running Drive Image in Windows, see if it has a DOS-level
option that runs outside of Windows. I use an old verson
of Drive Image Pro for imaging Win98/ME/2K via a boot
floppy. (XP's modified NTFS doesn't work, though) I had
tried using USB DOS drivers to image to USB hard drives,
but there was no consistency whatsoever from PC to PC
doing this. It generally worked for older PC's but slowly,
and not at all for new ones. I tried Ghost off a Systemworks
2003 CD, but its USB DOS drivers were also unreliable.

I had much better luck using network boot floppies to
access a shared-out USB hard drive attached to a PC.
If this Firewire glitch is a major issue for you and if you
have another PC handy, imaging over the network might
be a better option -- attach the Firewire drive to the other
PC, share it out and then back up to it over the network.

-BC

That XP-NTFS partition -- is that there because you
also have XP? You can conceiveably backup the ME
and/or 98 partitions to the Firewire drive regardless
if they are "hidden" or not.

-BC